Tuesdays 5:00pm - 6:00pm (EDT)
EPISODE SUMMARY:
Join Dr Sohee, the mindset expert, best-selling author, and leadership coach as she discusses how you can overcome the professional anxieties that disrupt your peace and hold you back.
WHAT YOU WILL LEARN:
Decision-making dilemmas, Feelings of overwhelm, fear of the unknown - we've all experienced these challenges as leaders and women sometimes experience these more often due to unhelpful scripts we've learn to believe are true about us. How do we flip the script? Dr. Sohee Jun will how to craft your own authentic definition of success, a framework to deal with fear, and strategies to navigate big decisions. We'll also talk about how to develop an Aligned Mindset, including how to recognize and distinguish your competing thoughts, reframe your mindset, give yourself grace, identify a direction that’s authentic to you and to get to where you genuinely want to go.
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ABOUT OUR GUEST:
Sohee Jun, Ph.D., is a premier leadership coach for women, mindset expert, bestselling author, corporate leadership facilitator, TEDx and keynote speaker, and thought leader and contributor to Forbes Coaches Council. She combines a Ph.D and Master’s in Organizational Psychology with invaluable executive and leadership experience at organizations ranging from the NASA Jet Propulsion Lab to Bank of America to Warner Bros. Entertainment. Dr. Sohee’s 20+ years transforming the personal and professional journeys of highly successful women, leaders, and celebrity clientele have earned her a place among the world’s most sought-after executive coaches and membership in the prestigious Forbes Coaches Council. Additionally, her work as a bestselling author, award-winning speaker, entrepreneur and podcast host have established Dr. Sohee as the go-to thought leader and solutions-based practitioner on the complex work and life challenges facing women today.
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LINKS MENTIONED IN EPISODE:
Guest: https://soheejunphd.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sjunphd/
https://www.instagram.com/soheejun_phd/
Our website: www.gotowerscope.com
https://soheejunphd.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sjunphd/
https://www.instagram.com/soheejun_phd/
:#mindset #keynotespeaker #leadershipcoach #drsoheejun #femaleempowerment #authenticity #TheHardSkills #LeadershipCoaching #LeadershipDevelopment
Tune in for this empowering conversation at TalkRadio.nyc
Dr. Mira Brancu welcomes listeners to The Hard Skills show, where she explores the challenging soft skills essential for leadership success. In this episode, Dr. Sohee Jun, an accomplished leadership coach and author, shares her insights on overcoming professional anxieties that often hold women back, rooted in social conditioning and self-doubt. The conversation highlights the importance of mindset shifts and intentional decision-making to help women leaders step into their full potential with confidence and authenticity.
Dr. Sohee Jun, in her new book The Aligned Mindset, identifies six unhelpful mindsets that hinder personal and professional growth, particularly for women. In this segment, she discusses the overachiever mindset, a relentless drive for more success that often leads to burnout, especially among women and marginalized groups who feel the need to work twice as hard to prove their worth. She emphasizes the importance of setting boundaries, overcoming societal expectations, and practicing self-compassion to create a sustainable and fulfilling career path.
Dr. Sohee Jun discusses perfectionism as a common mindset that compels leaders to obsess over details, leading to inefficiency and burnout by taking on tasks better delegated to others. Dr. Mira Brancu shares her experience overcoming perfectionism with a simple mantra—“Good enough is good enough”—highlighting the importance of embracing progress over perfection. They also explore the "should mindset," which pressures individuals to act out of obligation rather than alignment with their values, and how leaders can shift towards more intentional decision-making for greater fulfillment and impact.
In the final segment of this episode, Dr. Sohee Jun discusses the importance of developing an aligned mindset—where thoughts, actions, and words support how leaders want to show up in the world. She outlines a four-step framework to achieve this: building awareness of one's internal narratives, identifying unhelpful patterns, taking micro steps to reframe thoughts, and reinforcing progress with self-recognition. Dr. Mira Brancu highlights how these strategies align with cognitive behavioral techniques and emphasizes the power of starting small to drive sustainable leadership growth.
00:00:49.240 --> 00:01:03.719 Mira Brancu: Welcome welcome to the hard skills show where we discuss how to develop the most challenging soft skills required to navigate today's leadership complexities and tomorrow's unknowns. I'm your host, Dr. Mira Bronku.
00:01:04.640 --> 00:01:13.310 Mira Brancu: Decision, making dilemmas, feelings of overwhelm fear of the unknown. We've all experienced these challenges as leaders.
00:01:13.480 --> 00:01:21.829 Mira Brancu: Now women sometimes experience these more often because we've absorbed all of these unhelpful scripts about our abilities that actually aren't true.
00:01:22.150 --> 00:01:23.779 Mira Brancu: How do we flip the script?
00:01:24.350 --> 00:01:34.850 Mira Brancu: Dr. Sohi Jun will share her experiences and expertise for how to overcome the professional anxieties that disrupt your peace and hold you back.
00:01:35.000 --> 00:01:43.219 Mira Brancu: and my new millennials workbook for navigating workplace. Politics is out. It's been published. Get your copy today.
00:01:43.460 --> 00:01:57.150 Mira Brancu: Season 6 to 9 are all dedicated to this topic and season 6 is all about positive politics, and I really feel like Dr. Sohi will address that by giving us some tips on how to work through your stuff
00:01:57.300 --> 00:02:00.100 Mira Brancu: to engage effectively with others.
00:02:01.080 --> 00:02:02.470 Mira Brancu: So let me introduce her.
00:02:02.590 --> 00:02:19.029 Mira Brancu: Dr. Sohee Joon is a premier leadership coach for women, a mindset expert, a bestselling author, a corporate leadership facilitator, a tedx and keynote speaker and a thought leader and contributor to Forbes Coaches Council.
00:02:19.390 --> 00:02:38.420 Mira Brancu: She brings a Phd. And a master's in organizational psychology and executive and leadership experiences at organizations ranging from NASA jet propulsion lab to Bank of America, to Warner Brothers Entertainment. So she is, and she's also the author of the aligned Mindset, which, by the way.
00:02:38.540 --> 00:02:41.059 Mira Brancu: just came out today. Woohoo!
00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:50.069 Mira Brancu: So I'm super excited that I get to have her, and I get to talk to her on the very 1st day that her book is out. Welcome and great to have you on the show.
00:02:50.860 --> 00:02:57.279 Sohee Jun: Mira. Thank you so much. It is a very dynamic day, and I'm really looking forward to being in conversation with you.
00:02:57.460 --> 00:03:01.849 Mira Brancu: Yeah, it's gonna be fun and remind me, how did we meet?
00:03:02.910 --> 00:03:12.280 Mira Brancu: There's so many different ways. And I was racking my brains this morning when I was writing out, like, you know, the questions that I might be thinking about asking you, and I think I know.
00:03:12.560 --> 00:03:19.240 Sohee Jun: Yeah. Well, let me jog your memory. It's the forefront community of like minded people.
00:03:19.410 --> 00:03:22.519 Sohee Jun: And we were introduced through that community.
00:03:22.520 --> 00:03:50.509 Mira Brancu: That's what I thought. Yes, so forefront is kind of like the second generation. Brainchild, of Marshall Goldsmith, who, well bestselling author internationally renowned executive coach and educator, and he had his 100 coaches agency. And then from there the next generation of leaders thought leaders and folks within the leadership space is where we connected in the 2 forefront. Yeah? So.
00:03:50.510 --> 00:03:52.829 Sohee Jun: Perfect. Yeah, it looks like.
00:03:52.830 --> 00:03:58.049 Mira Brancu: So so he let's start with like, some sort of
00:03:58.550 --> 00:04:04.790 Mira Brancu: level setting around this this topic because decision-making dilemmas.
00:04:05.780 --> 00:04:21.899 Mira Brancu: Feelings of overwhelm fear of the unknown insecurities. This is what a lot of humble leaders, especially experience. Right? So why do you focus specifically on women, and especially high achieving women. When it comes to this space.
00:04:22.300 --> 00:04:31.400 Sohee Jun: Yeah, you know, I think that that's a really great question to start with, because I always coach from lived experience and in my world of
00:04:31.640 --> 00:04:53.649 Sohee Jun: living in the corporate space. I led teams, and I felt all of those challenges really intimately, Mira, I'm talking about staying up late at night because I was fearful of making a decision. Whether it was about my career, or what people would think about me, or how to lead a team, and all the different ways that that shows up in everyday work life.
00:04:53.690 --> 00:05:02.410 Sohee Jun: And I think that that's what I want people to know is that even if you're successful. In whatever ways that you define success.
00:05:02.530 --> 00:05:12.049 Sohee Jun: you will feel these levels of fear and indecision and challenges. And really, that's the premise of the second book, the aligned mindset and
00:05:12.190 --> 00:05:38.760 Sohee Jun: no surprise. Why mindset is at front and center? Because in my research with the highly successful women that are in my book that contributed. But also in my coaching. You know, I've been coaching for over 25 years now, and I work specifically with high achieving women because we live with that that indecision. And when you understand the power of the mindset, when you lock into that and can use it.
00:05:38.780 --> 00:05:43.150 Sohee Jun: it can really catapult people forward in ways that they didn't realize.
00:05:43.710 --> 00:05:49.629 Mira Brancu: Yeah. So why do women live with that indecision?
00:05:49.890 --> 00:05:50.430 Sohee Jun: Hmm!
00:05:51.310 --> 00:06:12.979 Sohee Jun: I think that it stems. I love to answer it by saying there's a constellation of factors, and there may be some unique contributors to the individual, the woman or person. And what I know to be true is that a lot of women? And this is, you know, a little bit genderized through the research that I've done and and through my coaching is
00:06:12.980 --> 00:06:32.529 Sohee Jun: that we tend to socialize and want to get approval and the external validation. And this is through years of conscious and unconscious messages that we've received growing up, whether it's in our own immediate household, or externally from the world, and perhaps both.
00:06:32.630 --> 00:06:48.730 Sohee Jun: We many of us grapple with the want and approval of others, and socializing our ideas, which looks like. For example, Mira, hey? You know, I want to write this book, and it's this topic. What do you think.
00:06:48.830 --> 00:07:09.949 Sohee Jun: even though we might know it in our gut, that this is a book worth writing, or it's a project worth pitching or a business worth starting. Or what have you fill in the blank? We want to go out and get the external validation. And it's largely part of our socialization, and how we are the messages that we grow up with.
00:07:10.500 --> 00:07:12.891 Mira Brancu: Yeah, I appreciate that you brought that up.
00:07:13.820 --> 00:07:20.920 Mira Brancu: you know, because a lot of times I feel like the leadership coaching
00:07:21.775 --> 00:07:26.500 Mira Brancu: executive coaching leadership development programs for women.
00:07:27.260 --> 00:07:36.640 Mira Brancu: Don't touch on that enough. And so then the message is, let me fix your faults
00:07:36.870 --> 00:07:42.349 Mira Brancu: instead of let's acknowledge that where you are
00:07:42.760 --> 00:07:56.890 Mira Brancu: is a result of a combination of who you are, plus your socialized self, your socialized identity, the way that women are, you know, taught from a very early age.
00:07:56.960 --> 00:08:15.480 Mira Brancu: more often than men, to question themselves, to question their reality, to question their ability to stay small, to you know, not, speak up and not take up too much space. And all of these things, when when it sort of like compounds and compounds and compounds on each other.
00:08:15.570 --> 00:08:23.649 Mira Brancu: makes us honestly, truly question our decision, making our reality. Are we doing the right thing? And also
00:08:23.790 --> 00:08:53.119 Mira Brancu: because women, the higher they go in leadership are scrutinized more, they're more harshly judged. Right? Then, of course, we're going to be more worried that our decision is going to cause this kind of negative judgment, or, you know, questioning, or that kind of thing. So it's an interaction with our environment that is creating this sort of complex pretzel pretzeling of ourselves. And it sounds like, you know, your entire
00:08:53.400 --> 00:08:59.659 Mira Brancu: focus, which is mine as well. We're passionate about it is to unpretzel ourselves a little out of that right.
00:08:59.660 --> 00:09:18.169 Sohee Jun: Yeah, I love. I'm a visual thinker, and I love that imagery of the pretzel, and it's so tightly wound up, and there's many threads to it. And the work that I do, and why I love the work of this podcast Mira is that it it's about bringing people back to their innate selves.
00:09:19.080 --> 00:09:36.590 Sohee Jun: When you add in, I love what you said about it is years and years, and there are external macro factors that contribute to that. It releases the pressure valve of saying like, Oh, wow! It it isn't all me. I'm not crazy. And I have these challenges that are both
00:09:36.720 --> 00:10:01.119 Sohee Jun: from the things that I've heard, and maybe the values that I adopted that were not mine when you question it. And I do a lot of values work with women as well. It's like, let's identify what those are, because that allows you to make intentional choices. And so maybe it's the values you adopted from your family of origin, or people around you, or the workplaces that you are in and have been in. So there's
00:10:01.120 --> 00:10:13.299 Sohee Jun: again, it's I wish I could say it's such an easy solve and an easy solution. It is a constellation of factors that I think makes it really interesting to work in partnership with women, and it's
00:10:13.300 --> 00:10:27.390 Sohee Jun: obviously work so worth doing. Because when we're able to quiet that noise or get, I would say more into like giving ourselves the validation that we need to make our choices.
00:10:27.480 --> 00:10:35.789 Sohee Jun: That's when we can step into our power and really own our decisions in a way that we hadn't or women hadn't before.
00:10:36.050 --> 00:10:39.028 Mira Brancu: Yeah, yeah, it. That's very powerful. I
00:10:40.430 --> 00:10:45.720 Mira Brancu: I want to dig in to your align mindset stuff. But before we get there, yeah.
00:10:45.920 --> 00:11:02.230 Mira Brancu: you mentioned. You have been a coach for 25 years way before it was cool to be a coach, and and that you come at it from a lived experience. And that is what drives you also. So I would love to hear. Kind of
00:11:02.370 --> 00:11:05.720 Mira Brancu: 25 years ago. What came to a head?
00:11:05.860 --> 00:11:19.699 Mira Brancu: What were you thinking about like in terms of your transition into coaching? How are you experiencing the world of work in your own sort of career trajectory? And how did you sort of get to this place where this is what I want to do?
00:11:20.840 --> 00:11:49.530 Sohee Jun: Yeah, there's so many questions in there, Mira. So if I coach from lived experience, as I said, because I walk the path that these women walk or have walked, and for me it looked like starting really early. Look, I am an immigrant from South Korea, and that meant that there were a lot of learned values and family expectations
00:11:49.530 --> 00:12:14.310 Sohee Jun: that come with being a South Korean, not born in the Us. And so what I learned through my teenage and high school years and into college is I really needed to own what was driving me. And it wasn't what I thought initially, which was, hey, mom and dad, I'm going to please you and do the medical degree route, and I think a lot of us.
00:12:14.360 --> 00:12:17.750 Sohee Jun: especially immigrants, want to do their parents proud and take that track.
00:12:17.970 --> 00:12:35.839 Sohee Jun: And for me it was the 1st step in saying, I actually am not interested in that. I have to own that. And the decisions behind that right, which is again the 1st step like, what? What is it that I want to do? Truly, what drives me? And then how do I communicate that? In a way that
00:12:36.860 --> 00:12:53.540 Sohee Jun: in a way that positions me for like, Hey, I'm doing this. I'm not going to ask for permission in a clear and kind way. And so that was the 1st step in my journey of really finding this path, that it lights me up every day, and that I say I have the honor of doing
00:12:53.540 --> 00:13:12.670 Sohee Jun: so. I got off the track of the medical degree and pivoted to psychology in college. I mean. Listen. I was studying psychology, anyway, with a minor in all the sciences. So it wasn't a hard pivot, but a really really important one. So that set off my career.
00:13:12.910 --> 00:13:23.730 Mira Brancu: Yeah, yeah, I I can relate. We've talked about this. I'm an immigrant to not from South Korea or an Asian descent. So that makes things different. You know you have a different lens than I do
00:13:23.740 --> 00:13:45.930 Mira Brancu: in the Us. But there are some sort of like immigrant experiences around wanting to not disappoint your parents, who have just started a new life, specifically, not just for them, but for you as well, and the pressure to please is heavy. And then on top of that, the pressure to please as a woman, as a
00:13:45.990 --> 00:13:50.240 Mira Brancu: it just adds like multiple identities around this
00:13:50.330 --> 00:13:55.080 Mira Brancu: pressure to fit in or be someone you're not, or
00:13:55.200 --> 00:14:02.830 Mira Brancu: please other people, or do something in someone else's vision. And to separate from that is an a major act of courage
00:14:02.990 --> 00:14:23.139 Mira Brancu: that you, you know, went through early on some. There are some women I think we both work with that are just starting to realize that now, like in their forties. Fifties right? That like. What have I been doing this whole time? And who am I? You know? And it is like a massive act of courage to to step in and say
00:14:23.510 --> 00:14:37.669 Mira Brancu: that path is not for me. And I'm gonna have to admit that not just to myself, but people who really care about me and want a different potential path for me. And now there's like proving to myself and proving to other people as well that I could do.
00:14:38.770 --> 00:14:57.490 Sohee Jun: I love that. Thank you for sharing yours, too. I completely agree. It's the layeredness of all of the expectations, whether it's stated outright or not, you pick it up and you sense it, and you know, not to mention that there's dollars put behind your college education that you're like. Wow! This is hard earned. So yes, there's pressure. And you know I
00:14:57.580 --> 00:15:22.460 Sohee Jun: felt innately that if I didn't share where I really wanted to go, that it would be a disservice to everyone, you know, because eventually I would find my way. I would just be prolonging it for myself and to your point about women that find it later in life. Great, you know, whenever you find it is when you find the courage to act, and I would say, just you know, take that next step forward, and for me that looked like saying, Hey, I'm going to get my Phd. In organizational psychology. Now look!
00:15:22.560 --> 00:15:24.429 Sohee Jun: The pleasing side of me. Mara is like
00:15:25.120 --> 00:15:30.630 Sohee Jun: I'm still getting a higher degree, and I am a doctor, just not a medical one.
00:15:30.630 --> 00:15:31.020 Mira Brancu: That's right.
00:15:31.444 --> 00:15:38.239 Sohee Jun: So I entered into a graduate program. That was all practitioner based in organizational psychology. And
00:15:38.250 --> 00:16:01.849 Sohee Jun: it didn't take me long to find that my superpower of being insanely curious about people combined with my ability to ask, really tuned in powerful questions, is where I made the biggest impact as a coach, so I noticed that early on, and decided to double down on that in all of the corporate experiences that I had.
00:16:02.140 --> 00:16:03.857 Mira Brancu: Yeah, yeah, great
00:16:04.610 --> 00:16:18.770 Mira Brancu: we are reaching an ad break. So we're going to take a break. And when we come back let's dig into like. Now, how does that connect to this aligned mindset idea that you've been putting together for a while? Now into a book
00:16:18.900 --> 00:16:24.489 Mira Brancu: you're listening to the hard skills with me. Dr. Mira Branku and our guest today, Dr. Sohi John.
00:16:24.590 --> 00:16:27.610 Mira Brancu: the author of the aligned Mindset.
00:16:27.720 --> 00:16:44.000 Mira Brancu: We air on Tuesdays at 5 Pm. Eastern time, and you can find us right now if you're listening to us. Live streaming on Linkedin Youtube and several other locations@talkradio.nyc. And we'll be right back with our guest in just a moment.
00:18:27.140 --> 00:18:40.269 Mira Brancu: Welcome welcome back to the hard skills with me. Dr. Mira Branku and our guest today, Dr. Sohi John, and with her new book that just came out today, the aligned mindset that I'm so excited to get into.
00:18:40.490 --> 00:18:48.909 Mira Brancu: So in your book you have 6 unhelpful mindsets that hold people back, and especially women.
00:18:49.340 --> 00:18:50.170 Mira Brancu: And
00:18:51.460 --> 00:18:55.310 Mira Brancu: What I'm wondering about is
00:18:55.830 --> 00:19:03.130 Mira Brancu: how did you came up? Come up with these mindsets before we get into the mindsets? How did you come up with them? Did you experience them yourself?
00:19:03.520 --> 00:19:09.507 Mira Brancu: And then when you list them out, I'm gonna see how many I check off for myself in early in my career.
00:19:10.530 --> 00:19:14.102 Sohee Jun: I love that you sure you want to do that test. Now.
00:19:14.400 --> 00:19:16.371 Mira Brancu: See how vulnerable I can be.
00:19:17.650 --> 00:19:31.209 Sohee Jun: So. Yes, I list 6, because it's a combination of really noticing I'm a theme maker like it. Themes jump out at me. That's 1 of my superpowers, and I noticed in my years of coaching.
00:19:31.210 --> 00:19:48.070 Sohee Jun: both in what women told me they wanted coaching around, whether they're aware of it, and also anecdotally noticing. Oh, wow! The slate of my coaching clients have said that they are dealing with imposter syndrome, or the people pleasing or
00:19:48.070 --> 00:19:53.130 Sohee Jun: wrapped up in fear, and it's getting curious to what was being presented to me
00:19:53.130 --> 00:20:04.139 Sohee Jun: through the coaching and definitely through my lived experience. I would be lying if I didn't say that I have felt every one of those listed in the book. So it's
00:20:04.140 --> 00:20:26.829 Sohee Jun: through the coaching. It's my own lived experience. And it's also through the research that I did for the making of the book. It was a 2 year process, and I researched highly successful women. There were 2 rounds of surveys that I did. And what I noticed is this theme around mindset? Not surprisingly, and you know.
00:20:26.910 --> 00:20:34.999 Sohee Jun: and not surprisingly, the in like. The Zeitgeist was talking about the power of the mindset, and really there was just more and more
00:20:35.190 --> 00:20:46.449 Sohee Jun: conversations being had around it. So I knew that there was something there that got me super curious to dive deeper. So that's how it was about. It became about the aligned mindset.
00:20:46.620 --> 00:20:53.879 Mira Brancu: Nice. Okay, let's get into it. What's unhelpful? Tell us the 6 mindsets, and just a little bit about what each means.
00:20:53.880 --> 00:21:07.150 Sohee Jun: Yeah. So the 1st that I list here, and I happen to have the book right in front of me. It's like my companion. It goes with me everywhere I go, and I will say the bear with me for a second.
00:21:07.150 --> 00:21:07.810 Mira Brancu: Yeah.
00:21:08.340 --> 00:21:12.020 Sohee Jun: 1st is the overachiever mindset.
00:21:12.500 --> 00:21:28.500 Sohee Jun: So these mindsets that I list in the book they overlap, and there's interplay between all of them, and I'll try to get as distinct as I can with defining them. The overachiever mindset is all about doing more, more, faster.
00:21:28.500 --> 00:21:45.190 Sohee Jun: bigger, and really this mindset has a hard time slowing down enough to say, Wow! That was a great job. Let me honor that now I need to slow it down. Take in the wins. It's always on to the next.
00:21:45.240 --> 00:21:50.689 Sohee Jun: And I know early on in my career and a lot of high achievement women, they do that
00:21:50.810 --> 00:21:56.559 Sohee Jun: constantly to get to the next thing, and the bigger thing, and the bigger corner office, and the bigger title
00:21:56.730 --> 00:21:58.420 Sohee Jun: which I have found
00:21:59.460 --> 00:22:10.640 Sohee Jun: that leads to burnout pretty quickly, and I'm sure that you've had clients come to you and go. You know what, Mira. I'm dealing with Burnout, and this mindset
00:22:10.940 --> 00:22:12.970 Sohee Jun: is a big contributor to that.
00:22:13.640 --> 00:22:19.930 Mira Brancu: Yeah, and to sort of differentiate this a little bit for our audience.
00:22:20.600 --> 00:22:26.040 Mira Brancu: Yes, there are plenty of overachiever men there. This is a society of
00:22:26.320 --> 00:22:30.669 Mira Brancu: overachievers. Right, like the the Us. Is a society of.
00:22:30.840 --> 00:22:41.939 Mira Brancu: you know, productivity, productivity, productivity, success, accolades, you know, recognition. All of that stuff is in our water right? And at the same time
00:22:42.805 --> 00:22:55.270 Mira Brancu: for for women and marginalized people, who are constantly told that they aren't good enough, or they they need to do more to be considered at the same level.
00:22:56.360 --> 00:23:06.169 Mira Brancu: We end up hyper achieving like going well above and beyond, just to be considered at the same level
00:23:06.300 --> 00:23:14.499 Mira Brancu: that people from A, you know, dominant culture are are considered in the, you know, in this, in this country. And so
00:23:15.400 --> 00:23:19.680 Mira Brancu: that does. That is a recipe for burnout, right? I mean.
00:23:19.680 --> 00:23:20.180 Sohee Jun: Yeah.
00:23:20.180 --> 00:23:27.800 Mira Brancu: If you're if you're working twice as hard to be considered, you know, to prove yourself to prove your worth. All of that stuff. What a recipe for disaster!
00:23:28.210 --> 00:23:42.000 Sohee Jun: Yeah, you know I love. Thank you for pointing out that it is very Us. Specific. And I would agree with you there, and how many things posts or people do we see talking about? It's okay to give yourself rest. I mean, that's there for a reason.
00:23:42.000 --> 00:23:58.589 Sohee Jun: because we are absolutely burning it on both ends, and I share a story about a time in which I was leading the biggest team, the Domestic Od and Change management team in my corporate life. I had the corner office had it all. I had 3 young children, I mean. I still have children, but they were younger
00:23:58.750 --> 00:24:08.279 Sohee Jun: time, and then I was like, you know what? I'm going to overachieve. That mindset was full throttle, Mira. And I said, I'm gonna host. I'm gonna coach. My daughter's soccer team.
00:24:08.280 --> 00:24:08.820 Mira Brancu: Oh, my! Gosh!
00:24:08.820 --> 00:24:22.599 Sohee Jun: Do all the things at home, and lead the team and work 60 whatever hours, and you better believe I was brink of burnout if I hadn't, you know, if that wasn't already the case. And so
00:24:22.810 --> 00:24:35.240 Sohee Jun: again, this is why I know intimately what it looks like and how burnout presents itself. And so that is what I want to help women undo and really redo that wiring.
00:24:35.420 --> 00:24:38.619 Mira Brancu: Yeah, yeah. Before we get to the second one.
00:24:38.760 --> 00:24:41.719 Mira Brancu: Is there a cost to the unwiring.
00:24:42.780 --> 00:24:45.670 Sohee Jun: That's a great question.
00:24:45.670 --> 00:24:46.240 Mira Brancu: Yeah.
00:24:46.240 --> 00:24:49.219 Sohee Jun: Tell me more about that. Unpack it a little bit more.
00:24:49.220 --> 00:24:50.289 Mira Brancu: You know I.
00:24:51.890 --> 00:24:57.371 Sohee Jun: Once you learn what it takes to quote unquote, succeed right?
00:24:58.130 --> 00:25:01.619 Mira Brancu: And then all of a sudden, you say no.
00:25:02.570 --> 00:25:06.410 Mira Brancu: No more. I have boundaries. I'm setting boundaries
00:25:07.397 --> 00:25:17.899 Mira Brancu: at some level within a woman's career. You get backlash for that, you know you. You get questioned, you are negatively judged
00:25:18.090 --> 00:25:22.898 Mira Brancu: unnecessarily right. For just putting up some boundaries
00:25:23.930 --> 00:25:28.989 Mira Brancu: for just trying to manage your your burnout. So I'm just curious about your thoughts, on that.
00:25:29.300 --> 00:25:38.520 Sohee Jun: Yeah, you know, I will counter that with, I think that more people end up respecting the women that put up boundaries.
00:25:38.860 --> 00:25:48.880 Sohee Jun: and the cost is a dip in your own self-esteem as you work with a coach or somebody to rewire that it. It doesn't feel good. It feels very
00:25:49.208 --> 00:26:13.859 Sohee Jun: like you're going into like a new world. That is like what what is at the end of this. And so the external accolades might disappear, except that people. If you lead a team, whether you lead a team or not in the workplace, you're around people, they see what you're doing. And then the generation that is, you know, coming up in the workforce. They absolutely, and this is anecdotal. But what I know
00:26:13.860 --> 00:26:26.590 Sohee Jun: is, they appreciate the boundaries, and so I think the cost is immediately to your own ego and your own way of doing things that feel super uncomfortable.
00:26:26.620 --> 00:26:39.150 Sohee Jun: But ultimately you do earn the respect of people that are like, oh, okay, well, she's not going to work on the weekends. I can respect that. The harshest critic is our own selves and our own minds.
00:26:39.650 --> 00:26:40.240 Mira Brancu: Hmm!
00:26:40.990 --> 00:26:49.103 Mira Brancu: I love that I've been there. I totally can agree with with and resonate with that experience after you know
00:26:49.710 --> 00:26:52.999 Mira Brancu: Learning how to be incredibly
00:26:54.470 --> 00:27:00.835 Mira Brancu: focused on my own boundary setting and do it well. And I've experienced, you know.
00:27:01.860 --> 00:27:13.817 Mira Brancu: the the shift is that the spaces that are healthiest for me will respect those boundaries and the ones that are not. Goodbye. They're not healthy for me, and I don't need it.
00:27:14.180 --> 00:27:27.349 Sohee Jun: Yeah. And, Mira, I love that. You're doing the work, too. And the goodbyes are not easy. Right? It's because it's like, Wow, you know that habit, or that person or that
00:27:27.520 --> 00:27:52.500 Sohee Jun: thing I was engaging in, even though you know it's healthy to say no, and draw some boundaries, whether it's work hours or no to an extra project. What have you? It's hard, and that's what I want everyone listening to know that this is a journey. And even though on this side of it, and I'd love to hear your take on it. I'm better at boundaries than I've ever been. I still like will miss it, and I still will be like oh.
00:27:52.540 --> 00:27:57.840 Sohee Jun: Crap! I should have said No, because I need the time to do something else, and guess what.
00:27:57.970 --> 00:28:16.169 Sohee Jun: when you're drawing boundaries. What I know to be true, and what I coach around is self-compassion as well. We need hefty, hefty doses of self-compassion, which I've had to learn, because it was not something that IA tool, a skill set that I grew up with.
00:28:16.340 --> 00:28:23.950 Mira Brancu: Yeah, I totally agree with that. And also it. I find that the self compassion is artist
00:28:24.180 --> 00:28:37.040 Mira Brancu: when there's somebody that I you know that's important to me, for example, who's disappointed with the boundaries I have set, and then then I'm my worst critic, and I have to sort of like really ground myself and remind myself like
00:28:37.150 --> 00:28:44.150 Mira Brancu: this is about their disappointment. But it's also about my needs. There's 2 2 people in this equation right.
00:28:44.750 --> 00:28:58.809 Mira Brancu: I noticed that we're reaching an ad break. I can't believe that we're already reaching another ad break. We are like. So into this before we get to the ad break. Let us know mindset number 2, and when we come back we're going to dive into mindset number 2.
00:28:58.810 --> 00:29:03.525 Sohee Jun: Mindset. Number 2. Drum roll is the perfectionist mindset.
00:29:04.370 --> 00:29:05.750 Mira Brancu: Yup! Yup! Yup! Yup!
00:29:05.750 --> 00:29:06.550 Sohee Jun: The breakdown.
00:29:06.550 --> 00:29:32.019 Mira Brancu: Yes, all right, everybody. We are reaching our ad break. You're listening to the hard skills with me. Dr. Mira Branku and our guest today. Dr. Sohi John, author of the aligned mindset, you can comment right now and ask us any questions as we're live streaming on Linkedin Youtube or other locations@talkradio.nyc. And otherwise we'll be right back with our guest in just a moment.
00:31:03.290 --> 00:31:09.440 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me. Dr. Mira Branku and our guest today, Dr. Sohi Jung.
00:31:09.570 --> 00:31:18.480 Mira Brancu: we are talking about the aligned mindset which is her new book, and we're she's outlining the 6 unhelpful mindsets
00:31:18.710 --> 00:31:28.980 Mira Brancu: before you get to an aligned mindset. And we're at Number 2 perfectionism. This is something that I think we hear a lot about. Tell me a little bit about it from your perspective.
00:31:28.980 --> 00:31:32.049 Sohee Jun: Yeah. So this is the mindset that
00:31:32.660 --> 00:31:49.620 Sohee Jun: compels you to get into the weeds that compels you to hold on a little too long to perhaps that email, reviewing it, making sure every single word is right or a project timeline detail, for example. And you make sure every now
00:31:49.620 --> 00:32:04.820 Sohee Jun: there's nothing wrong with looking for accuracy and making sure that the intention behind a message is there. And I'm just using those as examples. I think it's a slippery slope when we are operating out of this mindset, and you feel that you're the only one that can get it right.
00:32:04.890 --> 00:32:23.269 Sohee Jun: that you'll just take it on, because no one can do it better than you, and especially as a leader, you're diving into the weeds of things that perhaps you hired your employees to do, and you shouldn't really be operating at that level. So it's this drive to
00:32:23.350 --> 00:32:29.479 Sohee Jun: get detailed minutiae just right, just perfect in a vision that you only have in your head.
00:32:30.569 --> 00:32:36.640 Mira Brancu: Yeah, which means it's going to be hard for people to ever meet that vision
00:32:36.770 --> 00:32:38.409 Mira Brancu: right and
00:32:39.350 --> 00:32:47.270 Mira Brancu: from a clinical psych so. So he is an organizational psychologist. I/o psychologist, and I'm a
00:32:47.360 --> 00:33:06.700 Mira Brancu: coming from a clinical psychology perspective. So more from like mental health. And you know those kind of things, and perfectionism is not a diagnosis, and it's not a mental health condition, but it's on your way to Ocd. And the sort of the root of it is anxiety or fear of
00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:21.306 Mira Brancu: losing control being scrutinized. Being questioned. You know fear of not knowing. There's there's a lot of root causes to how perfectionism develops. And
00:33:22.390 --> 00:33:23.959 Mira Brancu: you know, for me.
00:33:24.460 --> 00:33:29.759 Mira Brancu: I remember disrupting it for myself
00:33:30.340 --> 00:33:34.190 Mira Brancu: when it got in my way by having
00:33:35.490 --> 00:33:48.797 Mira Brancu: sticker right in front of me for like, and and then eventually became a mantra in my head for 10 years. Good enough is good enough, Mira. Let it go good enough is good enough. Send it off, get some feedback, move it along.
00:33:49.200 --> 00:33:49.900 Sohee Jun: And it really.
00:33:49.900 --> 00:33:54.079 Mira Brancu: Did help because nothing bad happened.
00:33:54.240 --> 00:33:57.049 Mira Brancu: I just had to sort of expose myself to that.
00:33:57.380 --> 00:34:15.630 Sohee Jun: Yeah, I love that method because one, it's you playing with it. Okay, let me actually try it out. 1st of all, the mantra is, I recommend anyone to have a mantra that they can go to on the ready when they see themselves in this space, because it can when you repeat it, and it's something you're aware of to say to yourself.
00:34:15.760 --> 00:34:19.140 Sohee Jun: this is also the mindset work right? It's like when you can.
00:34:19.300 --> 00:34:35.030 Sohee Jun: and start to rewrite that story, it does start to shift things. And for you it took that. And and, by the way, this is like again, a journey that to undo this type of thinking and and thinking that
00:34:35.199 --> 00:34:50.149 Sohee Jun: that adds value. So another way, you know, to reframe it is. You know how you define value, and how you contribute in the workplace, or wherever you're at, and doing the work there as well.
00:34:50.520 --> 00:34:54.570 Mira Brancu: Love it. Yes, all right. Number 3. What you got.
00:34:54.770 --> 00:34:57.279 Sohee Jun: Number 3, the should mindset.
00:34:57.605 --> 00:34:59.229 Mira Brancu: Tell us more about that.
00:34:59.520 --> 00:35:00.080 Sohee Jun: Ha! Ha!
00:35:00.080 --> 00:35:00.900 Mira Brancu: Ha! Ha! Ha!
00:35:01.240 --> 00:35:15.609 Sohee Jun: Myself included. What I notice when I paid attention to how women talk is about. Oh, gosh! You know I should do this. I should go to this happy hour, I should go to this work function. I should take on this project.
00:35:15.790 --> 00:35:38.430 Sohee Jun: I should. And the second phrase of that, you know what's coming is that they don't really innately align to it. One give them energy, or they're not passionate about it, or they're flat out, tired, and don't want to do the thing, but the should is compelling them to do it, because there's a big tether of guilt wrap around that
00:35:38.550 --> 00:35:57.490 Sohee Jun: of this or this mindset of. If I don't do this and I won't be a good worker. Friend, partner, daughter, mom, what have you? And it? It drives one to overperform and overdo again.
00:35:57.950 --> 00:36:02.826 Mira Brancu: Yeah, absolutely. And I I was thinking the word obligation.
00:36:03.270 --> 00:36:03.829 Sohee Jun: When you were just.
00:36:03.830 --> 00:36:08.230 Mira Brancu: Describing it like you're doing it out of obligation instead of out of
00:36:08.758 --> 00:36:23.101 Mira Brancu: this is aligned with my interest, my passion, the things I care about, or how I want to show up in the world. No, instead, it's out of obligation to others. But there's not like sort of a and I'm going to get something out of this, too.
00:36:23.610 --> 00:36:43.040 Sohee Jun: Yeah, yeah, which is a framing that we haven't yet built the muscle around. To be honest in terms of, I get to get something out of this, too. Both things can exist. And I'm a big believer of the Yes, and which is a play on Improv, which is yes, that can exist, and something else can be true.
00:36:43.040 --> 00:36:56.320 Sohee Jun: So it really is kind of a binary thinking of like, oh, I should do it. I'm just going to do it, and you guilt yourself, kind of whip yourself into doing something that is depleting, and to your point not aligned.
00:36:56.470 --> 00:37:02.510 Mira Brancu: And it brings resentment right? If you're if you're doing it, and you can't find an end
00:37:02.700 --> 00:37:11.250 Mira Brancu: right like I should do this. And I'm gonna do it because I care like. Oh, I should go get, you know, and pick up my child from whatever you know, like.
00:37:11.250 --> 00:37:11.850 Sohee Jun: But if.
00:37:11.850 --> 00:37:20.489 Mira Brancu: It's not if it's coming only out of obligation. You end up being resentful. Other people end up seeing or feeling that, anyway. So everybody loses.
00:37:20.960 --> 00:37:29.540 Sohee Jun: Everybody loses. Yeah, here's something I want to offer for people to consider around the should mindset. If they find themselves mired in it. It's really to be
00:37:30.125 --> 00:37:53.230 Sohee Jun: thinking about the energy that in terms of how you show up when you are showing up from a should mindset. It does everyone a disservice versus when you are aligned with whatever that task or event is, and it might be a little bit of should, anyway. But, like you, show up so differently, energetically, which.
00:37:53.230 --> 00:37:53.560 Mira Brancu: Yeah.
00:37:53.560 --> 00:38:09.999 Sohee Jun: It's a win-win for everyone versus if you're driven more by shoulds, you're just kind of mailing it in right most of the time, and so you're not showing up as the person you want to be, anyway, in service of anything so really kind of thinking through that, and feeling through that.
00:38:10.180 --> 00:38:12.390 Mira Brancu: Yeah, excellent. Okay? Number 4.
00:38:12.740 --> 00:38:20.339 Sohee Jun: Number 4, the not good enough yet, mindset. And so this one presents itself like this.
00:38:20.750 --> 00:38:35.309 Sohee Jun: you know, Mira, I really am. I want to go do a speech, but I don't think I'm ready like I don't know. I'm just. I think I need a degree. I think I need to take a class. I think I need to do more, more, more
00:38:35.480 --> 00:38:39.240 Sohee Jun: to be ready to do the thing and
00:38:39.660 --> 00:38:56.480 Sohee Jun: play out so often in women playing small thinking they have to get an extra degree, or somebody else's advice, or another certificate before they take the step forward. And let's be clear. I think this is very much a female.
00:38:56.960 --> 00:38:58.730 Sohee Jun: A challenge
00:38:58.840 --> 00:39:13.799 Sohee Jun: in that. As I've coached men, too, the tendency for men is to raise their hand and to do it, even if they have the degree or not, because just because they think they can do it and build the plane as they go. Type of thing.
00:39:13.920 --> 00:39:19.430 Sohee Jun: So it is this kind of like? Oh, gosh! I'm going to stop myself. I'm not going to give myself.
00:39:19.660 --> 00:39:23.550 Sohee Jun: I'm not degreed or knowledgeable yet.
00:39:23.960 --> 00:39:32.987 Mira Brancu: Yeah. Yeah. And again, like a lot of these again, come from how we're socialized. If you go back to kind of what we were talking about earlier.
00:39:34.540 --> 00:39:37.499 Mira Brancu: If I have to work twice as hard
00:39:37.610 --> 00:39:46.349 Mira Brancu: to be acknowledged, valued, appreciated, recognized, put in a position of promotion, etc.
00:39:46.500 --> 00:39:53.599 Mira Brancu: Then I am going to go above and beyond to be seen in that way. And I'm gonna but at some point
00:39:54.220 --> 00:39:57.249 Mira Brancu: you are actually successful. You did the thing.
00:39:57.390 --> 00:39:59.409 Mira Brancu: and then you continue to do that.
00:39:59.630 --> 00:40:04.920 Mira Brancu: And then, all of a sudden, when an opportunity
00:40:05.120 --> 00:40:10.899 Mira Brancu: presents itself, and you're actually quite ready. You've been more than prepared more than ready.
00:40:11.468 --> 00:40:18.551 Mira Brancu: That women will be more likely to say, but I don't have that one certificate that would help me be even more prepared.
00:40:18.860 --> 00:40:38.819 Sohee Jun: Yeah. Yeah. And let me be clear that this isn't about being prepared for a thing. For example, let's take like presenting, you know, early in my career I over anchored into preparation, so much so that I would miss special events. So I was just like, I'm just going to do like 80 h of preparation which
00:40:39.180 --> 00:41:04.400 Sohee Jun: was really driven by this. I'm not good enough yet, and it's that balance of yes, prepare and yes, do your homework, and know when that's enough, and that is a healthy mindset versus being driven by. Oh, no one more thing exactly to what you're saying. I need more accolades. I need more degrees, notches of whatever that looks like for you before I do it.
00:41:04.550 --> 00:41:05.470 Mira Brancu: Yeah. Yeah.
00:41:05.700 --> 00:41:09.320 Mira Brancu: Absolutely. All right. 5. Number 5.
00:41:09.590 --> 00:41:20.159 Sohee Jun: This one's a big one, and and then it is a undercurrent, for probably all of the other ones, which is the fear mindset, and it
00:41:20.360 --> 00:41:31.220 Sohee Jun: gosh! It is when the it goes really big, you know I have an acronym for fear which isn't my own, but it is so powerful it is
00:41:32.060 --> 00:41:34.900 Sohee Jun: false events appearing real.
00:41:35.300 --> 00:41:37.340 Mira Brancu: Yeah, that's good. That's a good one.
00:41:37.340 --> 00:41:55.029 Sohee Jun: Yeah. And I know you've probably heard that before. So it's not mine. And I think it's a powerful way of like when our mind goes big and we make a decision based on that big amplified. What if? What if I get fired because I raised my hand? What if I can't ever find another job.
00:41:55.030 --> 00:42:19.239 Sohee Jun: And so I'm never going to move from this role. What if you know when I raise my hand for that project? I don't get it, and I just don't want to feel that shame. I don't want to take that risk, so fear and shame are really kind of tied together in this mindset. And it's when we go big in that fear and let our decisions be ruled by that way of thinking.
00:42:19.530 --> 00:42:21.849 Mira Brancu: Yeah, and absolutely.
00:42:22.070 --> 00:42:27.519 Mira Brancu: And so in the world of clinical psychology, we might call that catastrophizing.
00:42:27.710 --> 00:42:28.560 Sohee Jun: Yes.
00:42:28.560 --> 00:42:32.289 Mira Brancu: Sort of over worrying to the point where
00:42:32.570 --> 00:42:40.020 Mira Brancu: it it's well beyond what is actually in front of you that you're facing. And that is a actually a normal human
00:42:40.190 --> 00:42:44.210 Mira Brancu: reaction to many things is that we sort of
00:42:44.350 --> 00:42:56.630 Mira Brancu: have a tendency to over anticipate all of the what ifs trying to prepare and be ready for the worst. But our worst in our heads is way worse usually than what actually
00:42:56.800 --> 00:42:59.200 Mira Brancu: can happen in those kinds of situations.
00:42:59.200 --> 00:43:08.750 Mira Brancu: Yeah, we have, as I love to say, our brains are so powerful, and sometimes, if it's unruly, it goes really, really big in all the negative aspects.
00:43:08.750 --> 00:43:12.619 Mira Brancu: That's right? That's right. Okay, number 6.
00:43:13.410 --> 00:43:35.850 Sohee Jun: The number. The last one is the play, nice mindset. And, in other words, it's the people pleasing mindset. And we touched on this earlier. It's driven by the desire to have people not be upset with us, to put their needs about above our own. And I know this is pervasive, for so many women.
00:43:35.850 --> 00:43:48.670 Sohee Jun: I've been mired in it at times, and it is a tricky one, because we think we're well, we're just nice, like I don't have any needs. I'm just going to do what they say, because, you know, I like them. So
00:43:48.760 --> 00:43:53.360 Sohee Jun: it's it's big. And so that's the play. Nice mindset.
00:43:54.030 --> 00:44:00.070 Mira Brancu: Yeah. And this one is again like one of these tricky things that
00:44:00.410 --> 00:44:05.550 Mira Brancu: it works well earlier in your career, because
00:44:06.080 --> 00:44:13.923 Mira Brancu: in earlier in our careers. People are assessing like, can she be a team player, can she, you know? Can we trust her to
00:44:14.640 --> 00:44:16.605 Mira Brancu: Trust anybody to
00:44:17.520 --> 00:44:23.050 Mira Brancu: you know, work well in the workplace with other people, you know. So we're trying to be nice, and
00:44:23.410 --> 00:44:26.050 Mira Brancu: it does cause some contorting.
00:44:26.190 --> 00:44:33.770 Mira Brancu: And at some point it holds you back from being more competitive to stepping up to
00:44:34.490 --> 00:44:39.619 Mira Brancu: playing so nice that you just step back instead of continuing to step forward.
00:44:39.620 --> 00:45:03.019 Sohee Jun: Yeah, there's a number of ramifications from this mindset, which is one. I think it erodes trust over time in the workplace when we placate, and we are afraid of setting boundaries or saying yes to the right things. No, to the things that we don't align on. It gets to one a lack of trust for yourself for being able to like not being able to
00:45:03.130 --> 00:45:07.967 Sohee Jun: honor your own boundaries, and I think that people will see you as just like,
00:45:08.580 --> 00:45:16.039 Sohee Jun: just throw it to Zoe. She'll do it anyway. Type of thing where you kind of lose credibility and respect if you're over indexing in that way.
00:45:16.500 --> 00:45:36.249 Mira Brancu: That's brilliant, and it reminds me of I did an interview, a couple of interviews with Dr. Tony Zeiss, who at the time that I did the interview. She was the highest ranking mental health officer within the department of Veterans affairs that was also a psychologist and also a woman.
00:45:36.400 --> 00:45:40.929 Mira Brancu: And she's, she said. I learned that
00:45:41.030 --> 00:45:50.659 Mira Brancu: it's being kind. That's important, not being nice. So I'm kind, not necessarily nice, and that I never heard the distinction until she explained it, that.
00:45:51.280 --> 00:45:59.310 Sohee Jun: And being kind means you're clear and direct, and this is pulling from the work of Brene Brown, which is, there's a way to communicate that allows you to
00:46:00.170 --> 00:46:04.649 Sohee Jun: dear and also kind. So yeah, this is, this is a big one.
00:46:04.650 --> 00:46:23.580 Mira Brancu: Yes, yes, absolutely. Okay. We're reaching an ad break. You're listening to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Branku and our guest today, Dr. Sohi John. And now that we've gotten through her 6 unhelpful mindsets when we come back, we're getting to the helpful one, the aligned mindset that she wrote about. We'll be right back in just a moment.
00:47:58.870 --> 00:48:19.650 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me. Dr. Mira Brankwu and our guest today, Dr. Sohi, Jun. Who is the author of the align mindset. We just went through 6 unhelpful mindsets, and here we are, drum roll, please. We're getting to the align mindset. So he tell us a little bit about this. What is it.
00:48:20.190 --> 00:48:31.320 Sohee Jun: The aligned mindset is one in which your inner narrative and the way that you frame a situation is supportive of how you want to show up.
00:48:32.200 --> 00:48:55.640 Sohee Jun: and whether that's you want to be bold, or you want to be more clear and kind. Your brain and the ways that it supports you in that action is aligned. So it's similar to when I've heard this quote from Gandhi, I think it's when your thoughts, your actions, and your what you say, are all aligned.
00:48:56.470 --> 00:49:07.090 Sohee Jun: So it is that essence that when you can align your mindset and supportive of how you want to be in the world, it's very, very powerful.
00:49:07.650 --> 00:49:28.460 Mira Brancu: It is really powerful, and it sounds easy. It's not easy. So tell us, how do we slowly move from one of any one of these mindsets, unhelpful mindsets, or all of them, into a more and more aligned mindset. What does it take.
00:49:28.640 --> 00:49:39.049 Sohee Jun: Yeah. You know your listeners today get the privilege of getting the framework that's in the book, and there are 4 steps, and to your point
00:49:39.190 --> 00:49:45.499 Sohee Jun: 4 steps is not a lot, and it's really intentional, and it takes a lot of repetition to do
00:49:45.770 --> 00:49:52.729 Sohee Jun: so. The 1st step is not surprising, but awareness, create awareness
00:49:52.880 --> 00:50:12.790 Sohee Jun: about what you're telling yourself, how you're framing the situation, the meaning you're making up about a person, are you judging that person? If so why, what's the story behind that? Because also, when we're doing it to other people, it can damage relationships in the workplace.
00:50:13.070 --> 00:50:40.699 Sohee Jun: So that's a part of the threat of becoming aware. But, more importantly, start. Get insanely curious, Mira, about what is the brain saying about yourself? So, for example, if I'm about to go into a meeting, and it's with high, level executives if I'm unaware that my brain is like Oh, God! You are not ready! Oh, my God! I'm so nervous, and if I'm not aware of that, I will show up
00:50:40.790 --> 00:50:46.110 Sohee Jun: half of how I want to, and intend to, and certainly not dynamic and bold and confident.
00:50:46.650 --> 00:51:01.969 Sohee Jun: If we are insanely aware that our brain is doing that, then we can take the steps to reframe it, which now I'm jumping ahead in the framework. But let me step back to say, step one awareness, get insanely curious about the narrative.
00:51:02.190 --> 00:51:03.790 Sohee Jun: the stories in your brain.
00:51:04.420 --> 00:51:16.839 Sohee Jun: The second, then, is to identify it. Okay, so is this people pleasing right now, is it a multivaried mindset? Am I acting out of fear? Try to give it a name, so you can work with it.
00:51:17.650 --> 00:51:32.970 Sohee Jun: then the 3rd is to identify. What is that? Micro step forward. So what's that action that you can take? And perhaps in the example of presenting to the executives. It's going okay. My brain is going crazy.
00:51:33.030 --> 00:51:51.919 Sohee Jun: I'm going to identify that right now. It's really loud with fear. And I'm going to tell myself that I can do it. Anyway. They know me. I've rehearsed I'm ready. I know my statistics. I know the main messages. I can do this. So it's like telling yourself a more supportive
00:51:52.070 --> 00:51:53.130 Sohee Jun: framing.
00:51:54.450 --> 00:52:01.740 Sohee Jun: And then taking that step forward, breathing, going to the room and being more confident than if you were unaware.
00:52:02.230 --> 00:52:08.300 Sohee Jun: That's the 3rd step is taking that micro step forward. And, by the way, I say, micro, step really intentionally, because
00:52:08.560 --> 00:52:14.380 Sohee Jun: people get overwhelmed and thinking, oh, my God! I have to do everything all at once, and where do I begin? And I don't know.
00:52:14.770 --> 00:52:24.139 Sohee Jun: So micro step is really intentional and important, and the 4th thing is to really reward yourself. Give yourself the kudos for
00:52:24.490 --> 00:52:46.630 Sohee Jun: getting curious about what your mindset is doing for taking the supportive action forward for reframing those critical thoughts. And the reward part is something that a lot of people skip, not a big deal. Just move on. But that's really important to solidify that repetitive behavior, and the one that muscle that you want to build.
00:52:47.170 --> 00:52:48.699 Mira Brancu: I love this. And
00:52:49.340 --> 00:53:16.880 Mira Brancu: if we're sort of mapping it on to some clinical psychology concepts, it's number one very similar to some concepts around cognitive behavioral therapy. Right? You are sort of evaluating and slowing down enough to know what your thoughts and reactions are. And then, using that information to say, what would I be doing differently to disrupt or change
00:53:17.890 --> 00:53:26.129 Mira Brancu: and micro steps? I love it. That is so important for behavior change, because
00:53:26.840 --> 00:53:41.339 Mira Brancu: most people jump too fast and too big, and then get discouraged and say, forget it. That didn't work micro steps, I think sort of like helps to build tiny habits into bigger habits, atomic habits, right into bigger habits. And then
00:53:41.520 --> 00:53:57.710 Mira Brancu: the reward piece which so many frameworks do not include, but is so critical is all about reinforcement right like, am I reinforcing the behaviors, or did I say? Well, I tried it, and it was hard, and it didn't work, so I'm not going to try it again.
00:53:57.820 --> 00:54:14.754 Mira Brancu: or questioning yourself, or judging yourself for it not being perfect. Well, that's repeating your old habits when you're trying to disrupt it. And so that that reward or reinforcement is so so critical to behavior change. So
00:54:15.900 --> 00:54:19.509 Mira Brancu: I think if you pull it all together like this was a lot.
00:54:19.800 --> 00:54:32.340 Mira Brancu: What is one thing that you want people to be able to take away from today's conversation, to just like get started and disrupting kind of their old unhelpful patterns.
00:54:32.340 --> 00:54:54.750 Sohee Jun: Yes, I love that question for anyone interested in doing this work. I want them to one get the book and start getting insanely curious about their mindset out of the 6. So start there. It really does start from a place of awareness and getting the reason why I keep saying getting curious because it opens up a world of questions that perhaps
00:54:54.890 --> 00:55:05.770 Sohee Jun: you haven't asked yourself, or that opens up other thoughts and perspectives. So I would say, start with awareness. Get insanely curious about your mindset is the 1st place to start.
00:55:11.630 --> 00:55:26.509 Mira Brancu: Excellent, excellent. Sorry I was on the on the mute button, because I was trying to share also a little bit about you. Where can people find you? Those of you who are watching live right now? I have her web page up. But for those of you who are listening, where can they find you?
00:55:27.090 --> 00:55:41.889 Sohee Jun: They can find me obviously through my website. And I'm really active on Linkedin. I have Instagram so they can find me there. However, I don't really answer Dms. So Linkedin and my website to reach out directly.
00:55:41.890 --> 00:55:48.050 Mira Brancu: Excellent, and that is Sohee, jun. SOHE, EJUN,
00:55:48.350 --> 00:55:57.849 Mira Brancu: and you can find her there at Linkedin or sohijunphd.com is where you can find her on her website.
00:55:57.910 --> 00:56:19.260 Mira Brancu: All right, everybody. What did you take away? And more importantly, what is one small change that you can implement this week, based on what you learn from Sohi, or what you'll be reading from her book that you will definitely be buying. Share it with us on Linkedin, at Mira Branku, or so he, Jun, or@talkradio.nyc. So we can cheer you on.
00:56:19.260 --> 00:56:31.419 Mira Brancu: We are also on other social media platforms like Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Twitch, apple, spotify Amazon Podcasts everywhere. So find us leave a review to help with visibility and reach
00:56:31.870 --> 00:56:44.450 Mira Brancu: the stuff, the stuff that we talk about on this show is also part of the work that we do with our strategic leadership pathway, roadmap at Towerscope. You can check us out@gotowerscope.com.
00:56:44.640 --> 00:56:55.440 Mira Brancu: and thank you. Talkradio dot Nyc. For hosting. Thank you for joining us today with our guest, Dr. Sohi, Jun sohi. Thank you so much. We really appreciated having you on today.
00:56:56.050 --> 00:56:58.580 Sohee Jun: Thank you for having me. It's been so fun. Thanks, Mira.
00:56:58.580 --> 00:57:02.710 Mira Brancu: Absolutely have a great rest of your day wherever you're tuning in from bye. Everybody.
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