Tuesdays 5:00pm - 6:00pm (EDT)
EPISODE SUMMARY:
We have put much effort into diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) work over the last four years, but the results have been disappointing. Why? What should we be doing differently? Discover why many well-meaning leaders are left scratching their heads as underrepresented talent slips through their fingers, and employees push back against diversity initiatives. In this eye-opening episode, we'll unravel the mystery behind failed DEI strategies and reveal the missing pieces of the inclusion puzzle. This isn't just another DEI discussion – it's your roadmap to meaningful, lasting change built on psychological science, with our guest expert today, Dr. Gena Cox.
WHAT YOU WILL LEARN:
This episode will unlock the secrets to building a genuinely inclusive workplace with insights steeped in Industrial/Organizational psychology. You will discover a 3-point framework that cuts through the noise and become laser-focus on what truly moves the needle on organizational inclusion. We will move past the concept of "Respect" as a corporate buzzword and instead consider how it can be a powerful construct that can set your leadership apart in today's diverse business landscape.
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ABOUT OUR GUEST:
Dr. Gena Cox, an organizational psychologist with 25+ years of experience, is a leadership advisor, coach, and speaker passionate about creating inclusive workplaces. She helps leaders optimize company culture and employee experience to retain top talent and deliver their financial goals. Her expertise spans various industries, making her a versatile advisor for organizations seeking to thrive in today's disrupted business landscape.
Dr. Cox's clients are profoundly impacted by her ideas and often say her perspective has guided them to think about employees' day-to-day experiences in new ways. Gena shows clients that Respect is a powerful driver of many business outcomes they seek. Her strategies have helped clients reduce voluntary turnover by up to 4% annually, narrow employee engagement score gaps between groups, and see improvements in collaboration and innovation.
Author of the award-winning book Leading Inclusion, Dr. Cox's ideas are featured in business media including Fast Company, Forbes, Business Journal, and Harvard Business Review. Her Ph.D. is in Industrial/Organizational Psychology.
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IF YOU ENJOYED THIS EPISODE, CAN I ASK A FAVOR?
We do not receive any funding or sponsorship for this podcast. If you learned something and feel others could also benefit, please leave a positive review. Every review helps amplify our work and visibility. This is especially helpful for small women-owned boot-strapped businesses. Simply go to the bottom of the Apple Podcast page to enter a review. Thank you!
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LINKS MENTIONED IN EPISODE:
Guest LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/genacox
Guest Website: https:/www.genacox.com
Guest Giveaway: https://genacox.com/inclusionresources/
Our website: www.gotowerscope.com
#LeadingInclusion #respect #EmployeeEngagement #DEI, #OrganizationalDevelopment #OrganizationalImpact #TheHardSkills
Tune in for this empowering conversation at TalkRadio.nyc
00:00:31.660 --> 00:00:51.750 Mira Brancu: Hi! It's Dr. Mira Branku, host of the hard skills. And today we're talking with Guest expert, Dr. Gina Cox, who will help us unpack. Why, after so much effort, we've put into diversity, equity, and inclusion. Dei work over the last 4 years. The results haven't moved the needle enough. Why.
00:00:51.930 --> 00:00:57.069 Mira Brancu: what should we be doing differently? And what are the missing pieces of this puzzle?
00:00:57.210 --> 00:01:02.270 Mira Brancu: This is not just another de and I discussion. It is your roadmap
00:01:02.280 --> 00:01:03.750 Mira Brancu: to meaningful.
00:01:03.830 --> 00:01:07.399 Mira Brancu: lasting change built on psychological science
00:01:07.470 --> 00:01:14.829 Mira Brancu: that Dr. Cox will share with us. And it's perfect for season. Five's focus on making a greater impact. Now.
00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:26.039 Mira Brancu: on this show, we discuss how to develop the nuanced hard skills. That's where the name comes from, meaning the most challenging soft skills needed to make a real impact through your leadership.
00:01:26.340 --> 00:01:44.049 Mira Brancu: I'm a leadership consulting and coaching psychologist, group and team facilitator, an associate professor, a psychology today columnist, author of millennials, guides to workplace politics and had my own leadership career before transitioning to helping teams and high achieving women navigating their own leadership complexities.
00:01:44.170 --> 00:01:50.110 Mira Brancu: Now, before I introduce Dr. Cox, I do want to make one quick announcement
00:01:50.160 --> 00:02:18.470 Mira Brancu: that for the next 2 weeks we've opened up a new 10 week leadership accelerator. It's called fuel, which, of course, I have to have an acronym, you know, folks. So which stands for focused, unstoppable, empowered leadership. It's made for high performing high achiever misfits who have a hard time with pacing and overdoing things and stand out, maybe in ways they don't want to right now, but ways that are incredibly
00:02:18.510 --> 00:02:44.909 Mira Brancu: impressive, and we want to bring the best, but they want to make a more intentional and strategic approach to their next leadership role, even if they haven't identified what that role is. So we have 5 spots open. You can learn more and enroll by September 19th by going to go towerscope.com and clicking on leadership community programs and then clicking on fuel. We start September 23rd would love to have you part of it.
00:02:45.250 --> 00:03:07.199 Mira Brancu: Okay? Without any further ado. Dr. Gina Cox. She is an organizational psychologist, leadership, advisor, coach and speaker, passionate about creating inclusive workplaces with 25, over 25 years of experience. She helps leaders optimize company culture and employee experience to retain top talent and deliver their financial goals.
00:03:07.410 --> 00:03:19.160 Mira Brancu: Her strategies have helped clients reduce voluntary turnover by up to 4% annually. Narrow employee engagement, score gaps between groups and see improvements in collaborative collaboration and innovation.
00:03:19.510 --> 00:03:23.760 Mira Brancu: She is the author of award-winning book, leading inclusion.
00:03:23.950 --> 00:03:38.589 Mira Brancu: and her ideas are featured in business media, including fast company. Forbes, Business Journal, Harvard Business Review. Her Phd. Is in industrial and organizational psychology, so welcome and great to have you on the show. Gina.
00:03:38.860 --> 00:03:48.790 Gena Cox: Amira. It's so good to be here. I should call you Dr. Branku. You know us psychologists. We worked really hard to get those degrees. But it's really a pleasure to be here.
00:03:48.790 --> 00:03:54.415 Mira Brancu: Yeah, really great to have you. We can. We can. Now, now that it's official, we can call each other by 1st name.
00:03:56.038 --> 00:04:03.050 Mira Brancu: Okay? So in your experience, so actually, let me start with this. You wrote this book in 2,022.
00:04:03.160 --> 00:04:19.821 Mira Brancu: Right? That's post pandemic. You were tracking how the implementation post George Floyd was going when it comes to diversity, equity, and inclusion work. Once there was kind of a renewed, finally a renewed energy around it. Right? And as you've been tracking
00:04:21.260 --> 00:04:33.779 Mira Brancu: it seems like the results of all of this. These efforts have not necessarily completely come to fruition just yet right? And so, what are the most common challenges, leader face
00:04:33.800 --> 00:04:40.400 Mira Brancu: when they are trying to create these inclusive workplaces and trying to apply these new frameworks.
00:04:40.880 --> 00:05:08.539 Gena Cox: Absolutely mayor. So you're up, you know. I saw exactly what you just said, which is that many leaders had really good intentions that came to the fore that caused them to focus on this issue in a new way. After both Breonna Taylor and George Floyd were killed in 2020. And so that's laudable. Unfortunately, though, I would have to say that the main hindrance I I perceive, and have sort of studied at this point now for years
00:05:08.540 --> 00:05:13.619 Gena Cox: to progress towards building. This ideal of the inclusive organization
00:05:13.950 --> 00:05:16.279 Gena Cox: was that Number one.
00:05:16.600 --> 00:05:41.510 Gena Cox: It it turns out that inclusion really tops diversity. What many leaders were doing was, they jumped right out and said, we need more diversity in our organization. We need more square people, more triangular shaped people, more round people, whatever they decided, and then they went full force to try to enhance the diversity of these target groups. The problem was that they had laid no foundation. And so, when the squares and the and the
00:05:41.510 --> 00:06:06.420 Gena Cox: triangles came into an organization that previously had only ever seen rectangles, and only understood rectangular behavior, what I observed, and what many others have documented is that often those employees did not stay. It felt to them like, maybe there were the 11th person at a dinner table that was set for 10, you know. Where's my fork, and where is my plate? And where's my chair? And you're you know you invited me to the party, but it doesn't seem as though you really expect
00:06:06.420 --> 00:06:30.210 Gena Cox: to make room for me. That was one of the major problems that that has caused a lack of progress, because, even though they might have been initially some improvements in diversity, what tended to happen was that those employees did not stay in those organizations, or they stayed and reported low levels of engagement as a result of the experience. Another thing that tended to happen was
00:06:30.210 --> 00:06:38.089 Gena Cox: the hiring of the chief diversity officer. And for all of you listening who are chief diversity officers. I have absolutely nothing against you.
00:06:38.240 --> 00:07:03.229 Gena Cox: There's nothing wrong with chief diversity officers the problem was that organizations were sort of just, you know, doing lip service. They wanted this role in place so they could say they were doing something, and so they hired individuals into organizations absent, any kind of overall enterprise strategy about what the role was intended to accomplish. And then the roles were not given the political clout that was necessary. They weren't given the financial
00:07:03.230 --> 00:07:22.849 Gena Cox: resources that were necessary, and often found themselves sort of dangling on a limb where the minute something went wrong. They got the blame as being ineffective in their roles when really they were never set up for success. You know those are 2 significant factors. The 3, rd a 3rd factor, though, that that really gets in the way is that
00:07:23.120 --> 00:07:40.850 Gena Cox: this is the kind of thing that needs to be led at an enterprise level. And so, as I said, you know nothing wrong with chief diversity officers, but only if they're set up within an overall system that says, this is what we're solving for. Here's what we'll know when we're making progress. And everybody in the organization is moving towards that
00:07:41.220 --> 00:07:50.550 Gena Cox: which, of course, also means, Mira, that the CEO and the C-suite and the board have got to lead this from the top, and that was something that was often missing.
00:07:51.500 --> 00:07:52.034 Mira Brancu: Yeah,
00:07:54.280 --> 00:08:05.079 Mira Brancu: so many important points that you made. And I just want to sort of highlight number one. I heard the sort of leaning into quantity.
00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:09.630 Mira Brancu: but not enough quality, the quantity being diversity numbers.
00:08:09.690 --> 00:08:12.069 Mira Brancu: but the quality being all around.
00:08:12.120 --> 00:08:13.910 Mira Brancu: What's the experience.
00:08:13.910 --> 00:08:14.310 Gena Cox: Okay.
00:08:14.310 --> 00:08:21.209 Mira Brancu: People want. Once they're promoted into higher level positions, for example, right? And that quality wasn't there
00:08:21.310 --> 00:08:24.230 Mira Brancu: right? And then the second, I heard was
00:08:24.620 --> 00:08:32.230 Mira Brancu: the chief diversity officer hired out of lip service, but not with fully resourced
00:08:32.419 --> 00:08:33.470 Mira Brancu: capabilities.
00:08:33.880 --> 00:08:41.419 Mira Brancu: actually implement all the things, and then the last was willingness to readjust the system which includes
00:08:41.500 --> 00:08:45.150 Mira Brancu: full support and visibility and engagement from the top.
00:08:45.150 --> 00:08:51.467 Gena Cox: Absolutely you. You nail those 3 things. And and, by the way, those 3 things are still happening.
00:08:51.800 --> 00:08:55.674 Mira Brancu: Yeah. Well, because you know, I I think some of it is
00:08:57.870 --> 00:09:06.867 Mira Brancu: It's easy to just place people in situations, and then, like, take your hands off the wheel right like. But what happens to the car when you take your hands off the wheel.
00:09:07.140 --> 00:09:07.920 Gena Cox: That's right.
00:09:07.920 --> 00:09:08.820 Mira Brancu: Right.
00:09:08.820 --> 00:09:34.120 Gena Cox: And I've spoken to many leaders who have good intentions. In other words, I I sincerely believe that. If you run an enterprise and you're you have to think about this issue. In fact, recent data coming up from Sarah Mountain and other organizations indicate that you know a a majority of executive leaders believe that they should focus on this issue these issues, and they will continue to focus on these issues regardless of what you might read in the popular press.
00:09:34.120 --> 00:09:49.859 Gena Cox: however, there is a gap between that desire and their and their the actions they take that has to do with number one, not really understanding what are the critical. You know what really matters. Some of the things I talked about earlier and others.
00:09:49.880 --> 00:09:51.430 Gena Cox: but also
00:09:51.550 --> 00:10:09.660 Gena Cox: there is a larger, broad, is a broader sort of political environment that is relevant to the conversation in that. Sometimes leaders just want to kind of keep their heads down. With regard to this issue. But this is not one of those issues. I think, where you can make progress if you're not prepared to leave from the front.
00:10:10.390 --> 00:10:11.476 Mira Brancu: Yeah. And
00:10:12.390 --> 00:10:13.639 Mira Brancu: you're right it.
00:10:14.400 --> 00:10:18.389 Mira Brancu: The the desire is there. But it takes
00:10:18.790 --> 00:10:21.069 Mira Brancu: much deeper understanding
00:10:21.380 --> 00:10:22.450 Mira Brancu: to
00:10:22.858 --> 00:10:34.369 Mira Brancu: actually implement, really anything, anything of success with success is, you need to understand everything that is required to be able to be successful. And this is one of them. This is not just like.
00:10:34.430 --> 00:10:40.240 Mira Brancu: you know, some random additional thing that you're implementing it, require it. There's a science behind it, right.
00:10:40.240 --> 00:10:41.140 Gena Cox: That's right.
00:10:41.270 --> 00:10:48.969 Gena Cox: you know, you know, in many ways I count the clock of this this current era. In this conversation I count the clock
00:10:48.970 --> 00:11:13.200 Gena Cox: from March of 2020 when Breonna Taylor was killed. And you know we can talk about that if if we, if it makes sense. But that's when I start the clock. So if we if we say march of 2020, we're really talking about, you know, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024. I consider us in this era, where we really only had 4 years when top level leaders in American businesses had agreed that this was an important issue.
00:11:13.330 --> 00:11:37.990 Gena Cox: The issue was not new or and it wasn't new in 2020. But between the passage of the Civil Rights Act and and all the Civil Rights Act legislation in the 19 sixties, up until 2020. Generally speaking, leaders of did not deal directly with these issues. I remember working, for example, as an as an advisor where we were analyzing employee experience data
00:11:37.990 --> 00:12:02.389 Gena Cox: and making significant contributions to the activities of a C-suite. But what would happen was that often the Hr. Departments would keep the data that was cut by gender race ethnicity, Lgbtq plus status, and so on. They would keep that in a separate report, and it never got reported to the C-suite. And so often those leaders just didn't even know how bad this problem was and discovered, you know, maybe for the 1st time in 2020,
00:12:02.390 --> 00:12:12.259 Gena Cox: how bad the problem was in their organization. So you know, I think we all have to give. We have to give each other grace, and we have to recognize that this is
00:12:12.260 --> 00:12:33.739 Gena Cox: something where the understanding of it is relative is very new. Those leaders weren't taught about this, you know, in their Mba programs, or wherever they were taught to lead. Nevertheless, they also have to think about Con, the possibility that there. It is not rational that you would attempt to lead this kind of work or approach it
00:12:33.820 --> 00:12:41.810 Gena Cox: in any way different than you would approach any other enterprise strategy that really matters for your business, and that doesn't happen either.
00:12:42.270 --> 00:12:51.182 Mira Brancu: Yeah, absolutely. I have a million questions in my head, but at at the cost of derailing us just a little bit since you open the door. I'm gonna ask
00:12:51.570 --> 00:12:52.770 Mira Brancu: Why
00:12:52.960 --> 00:13:00.640 Mira Brancu: count from Brianna Taylor's murder? Why, why start there? I'm just very curious.
00:13:00.640 --> 00:13:06.210 Gena Cox: That's where I start, because that was the event. That was the occurrence. That was the horror that changed my life.
00:13:07.340 --> 00:13:35.199 Gena Cox: Brian, when Brianna Taylor was was killed. I could not understand literally. My brain could not process. What do you mean? She's in her room. She's in her bedroom. She's shot by cops. She's dead in her home like that didn't even seem like it was possible. And the other thing about Breonna Taylor was, I thought you know, she could have been my, she could have been my daughter. And so it had a profound emotional effect on me, and it was the primary, precipitating reason why I wrote that book, leaving inclusion.
00:13:35.578 --> 00:13:43.140 Mira Brancu: That is really meaningful. Yeah, and we all really do need to think about this. From a meaningful personal
00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:56.499 Mira Brancu: perspective. Right? This is not just some random thing that organizations may or may not do. It's personal to people's lives and livelihoods within organizations. And
00:13:56.500 --> 00:14:17.970 Mira Brancu: what they're bringing home with them from those organizations as well. So let's put a pause right there. We're reaching an ad break and I'd love to continue this conversation after the ad break. You're listening to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Bronku and our guest today, Dr. Gina Cox, author of leading Inclusion. We air on Tuesdays at 5 Pm. Eastern, and we'll be right back in just a moment.
00:16:30.160 --> 00:16:38.030 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Bronku and our guest today, Dr. Gina Cox, author of leading inclusion.
00:16:38.525 --> 00:16:44.749 Mira Brancu: Now, Gina, I want us to go through some of those challenges that you mentioned.
00:16:45.427 --> 00:16:47.340 Mira Brancu: Starting with this.
00:16:47.816 --> 00:17:03.949 Mira Brancu: What I call quantity, not quality, inclusion topping. Diversity is how you you termed it, right when we sort of earlier stages it was called DE. And I, starting with diversity, and that seems like
00:17:03.970 --> 00:17:05.319 Mira Brancu: hyper focused
00:17:05.369 --> 00:17:16.340 Mira Brancu: then on diversity. And all of a sudden, like we, we didn't pay enough attention about the equity and the inclusion pieces of that acronym. So later on. What I've noticed is
00:17:16.480 --> 00:17:34.770 Mira Brancu: that some folks started changing the acronym to put what and more emphasis on the things they felt like were important. So, Edi, we've seen that equity, diversity, and inclusion right? I've I've seen, IDEI. A right which is inclusion, diversity, equity, and access.
00:17:34.850 --> 00:17:42.929 Mira Brancu: and Jedi, which adds justice, right? But you have an interesting framework. REDI ready?
00:17:43.390 --> 00:17:48.760 Mira Brancu: Let's talk about that one. What are your thoughts on? What's important when
00:17:48.790 --> 00:17:50.239 Mira Brancu: you created that acrony.
00:17:50.240 --> 00:18:04.129 Gena Cox: Yeah. Well, 1st of all, let me say the acronyms matter, and and they don't right. I I am not wedded to any of those acronyms. And I tell people that it's a distraction to be too worried about what the right acronym acronym is.
00:18:04.130 --> 00:18:05.700 Mira Brancu: Totally isn't. Yes.
00:18:05.700 --> 00:18:21.949 Gena Cox: Because by de and I, when someone says, What's de? And I I don't say, Well, of course, I say diversity, equity, and inclusion, because that's the acronym. But what I say is that De and I is really about healthy work cultures, effective leaders
00:18:21.950 --> 00:18:39.339 Gena Cox: and positive day to day employee experiences. It's about these 3 fundamental experiences that every employee should have, including the Rec. You know the triangular people who work mostly around square people, or what have you. Everybody should be able to have those things.
00:18:39.340 --> 00:18:52.500 Gena Cox: And and so, fundamentally, what I'm saying, then, is that De and I, as I think about it, is really a leadership obligation. It's not a moral obligation, it's a leadership obligation. And so
00:18:52.500 --> 00:19:16.330 Gena Cox: I thought this way for a very, very long time. But as I thought about my own experiences, experiences of people who look like me, stories I had heard ever since I came to the United States. Because I think living having come to the United States at age 21 was helpful in that. It gave me sort of a pre and a post, something to compare to know that things didn't always happen
00:19:16.330 --> 00:19:24.869 Gena Cox: have to be exactly the way that I was experiencing them here. But anyhow, so because I think of this whole idea as this leadership obligation.
00:19:25.360 --> 00:19:35.839 Gena Cox: One of the things that was clear to me as I was consulting to organizations for decades is that there was something going on that was preventing some people
00:19:35.840 --> 00:20:00.120 Gena Cox: from seeing some other people in their full humanity, their full, you know, worth as humans. Something was getting in the way, certainly in the way for the police officers in those extreme circumstances, and so on. So I became fascinated with this concept of respect. And I'll tell you another thing about respect that was evident to me again, I think because I was an immigrant to this country, and that is that
00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:13.080 Gena Cox: when I came to United States I realized that people responded to me as she as a black woman like Gina is a black woman. So everything that people thought they understood about me, how people
00:20:13.080 --> 00:20:37.339 Gena Cox: related to me what they thought I would do and not do. I understood, I came to see was primarily predicated on how I looked, which was a new experience. Okay. So once I understood that I had to try to figure out, well, well, how do I get to be a good black woman, because I you know, I don't even really know what that is. And I'm being a little facetious because this these are things that happen over time you don't like. Make it one day and start analyzing this.
00:20:37.390 --> 00:21:01.559 Gena Cox: I'm getting to the point, believe it or not. And so, as I had been thinking about this, I could see that there was this thing, some barrier. There was something getting in the way, and then I discovered, lo and behold that when I talk to black Americans who have lived only in this country, there's a word that they use so often that it's not even thought about, and that's the word respect.
00:21:01.560 --> 00:21:08.610 Gena Cox: People will routinely say things like you're gonna you better put some respect on my name, or
00:21:08.610 --> 00:21:29.139 Gena Cox: they might say you don't have to like me, but you will respect me. I mean, that is said so often that there's actually language around that that is used in a very informal way within communities that are primarily African American, meaning that shared experience of being descendants of slaves in this country. So any of the enslaved in this country. But
00:21:29.140 --> 00:21:53.440 Gena Cox: so the respect thing I knew was important. And as I did my, I did some research in preparation for my book, it really wasn't specifically focused on respect. But there was a question that I asked which had to do with what is it that you would want your leaders to know about your experience in your in their organizations from an inclusion perspective. People had a lot of things to say, and I noticed that the responses
00:21:53.440 --> 00:22:05.860 Gena Cox: from black Americans where they were much longer. There were more responses, they had a lot to say, and a lot of it really. Just in the end when I content analyzed it in the end. What they were talking about was this respect thing.
00:22:05.860 --> 00:22:20.600 Gena Cox: In other words, imagine, then, that inclusion has a lot to do. Not just with, you know. Am I paid fairly, you know? You know. Do I get the job I desire? And all of those things? What if it really has to do with?
00:22:20.600 --> 00:22:45.599 Gena Cox: Do I believe that when I show up you see a whole full human in front of you? And so the R. For respect, I just thought, needs to be at the front of any acronym that we use to describe this work. So I just kind of slapped it in front of the of the Edi. And I say slapped, because you can tell I'm not. I don't expect people to start necessarily using our Edi and replacing Dei, or I mean it, I don't.
00:22:45.600 --> 00:22:51.990 Gena Cox: It matters. What matters most is that they think about putting respect first.st Yeah.
00:22:52.180 --> 00:22:54.672 Mira Brancu: I love and really appreciate.
00:22:56.090 --> 00:23:02.409 Mira Brancu: how you describe how you came to identify this specific experience as kind of the crux
00:23:02.500 --> 00:23:05.619 Mira Brancu: of if we could adjust this, how much
00:23:05.690 --> 00:23:27.740 Mira Brancu: can we change about our organizational health and experiences? And that really resonated? Not just like at a human level for me, but also just, you know, from my own anecdotal experiences, also working with leaders and when talking with black women and their experiences. Right? And so. But I'm curious, because I feel like sometimes
00:23:27.970 --> 00:23:34.259 Mira Brancu: there's so many definitions of respect when people say so and so does not respect me. I don't feel respected.
00:23:34.380 --> 00:23:36.540 Mira Brancu: I constantly wonder.
00:23:36.670 --> 00:23:54.389 Mira Brancu: But what be? What does that look like for you cause I think it looks different for different people, right? And so what did you learn from the stories that you gathered in your research? I know you you mentioned. Do I believe that you see me as a whole person? What goes into that.
00:23:54.390 --> 00:24:21.676 Gena Cox: Yeah. So you know, there, there are all kinds of of psychological studies about the concept of research. And also they exist in sociology, and they exist in anthropology and and in the law. Even so, research gets studied a lot, they but we all, most people agree that, in fact, yes, there are different kinds of respect. The kind of respect that I'm talking about, though, is this this idea that
00:24:22.370 --> 00:24:51.089 Gena Cox: I'm not talking about the earned respect the kind of respect that comes by virtue of having done something, and people go. Oh, wow! Like that's called earned respect. Nothing wrong with that. But that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking more about the kind of respect that just is. A a sort of any human being on the planet is entitled to and based on the work that I have done and what I have studied, I when I think about this definition of respect, I think about it in terms of? Does a person feel seen?
00:24:51.130 --> 00:25:15.729 Gena Cox: Do they feel heard, and do they feel valued, you know, and being seen, of course, seen, of course, is all about sort of being acknowledged, you know. Sort of you show up in the place, and even just a nod or or eye contact lets you know that this person recognizes they're seeing another human there that that exists in this space, and therefore, you know, should be noticed. Being heard, of course, is about having space
00:25:15.730 --> 00:25:39.690 Gena Cox: to do. Both express your ideas and believe that others are doing something with them. So you can express ideas. People accept the ideas, they listen to them, they act upon them, and even in some cases give you credit. You know, when the idea is yours. So it's more about sort of the expression of your it's not more about your impact in in where you're where you're operating, are you having? Are you able to have that impact
00:25:39.690 --> 00:26:05.279 Gena Cox: and being valued. It's not just about, you know, compensation and pay, although we think about those things and those things are important. When I think about being valued. I think about it in terms of recognition as well. I think about things like opportunities for promotion and visibility. You know, opportunities to have those jobs that everybody you know that are, everybody knows are at the top of the pile. They could be the revenue
00:26:05.280 --> 00:26:33.399 Gena Cox: jobs or the the you know, the product development jobs, the more glamorous kinds of things versus always having the jobs that are sort of in the basement. Or, you know, to think about that mo, a movie, that we all. I can't think of the name of the movie. But there's a very funny movie about this, that idea once. So you know, being valued is about this notion that you get the chance to be optimized, and if for whatever that, whatever that means, and of course it differs for person. So when I think about
00:26:33.400 --> 00:27:01.299 Gena Cox: respect, I'm thinking about these very, these things in that way, and I like to talk about them in that way to sort of encourage people to just use that as a shorthand to help them. Remember, you know, what? What does it mean, what to do. It's not really an abstraction. I'm trying to make it sort of more concrete. So people can just remember these 3 ideas. And if you do those things the odds are. You're good in your interactions with every other person.
00:27:01.300 --> 00:27:10.900 Mira Brancu: Yeah, yeah, I I really like that additional word that you use optimized, you know, like you're you're pulling at the best
00:27:11.120 --> 00:27:12.140 Mira Brancu: of
00:27:12.523 --> 00:27:27.280 Mira Brancu: what people have to bring, instead of sort of shutting them out or ignoring their talents or underutilizing their talents. You're you're seeing them for all of the things that they could bring to the to the organization is that kind of.
00:27:27.280 --> 00:27:35.879 Gena Cox: It is. And, Mira, do you know why that is so? It so absolutely right. I you're hitting the nail on the head in terms of my intentional you know, emphasis.
00:27:35.880 --> 00:28:00.350 Gena Cox: And I emphasize this idea because what I know based on data from a variety of sources, including an organization called Coqual, that has done a lot of research in this area. I I think there's also been a lot of work done on this at Mckinsey is that for people who come from traditionally under represented groups in corporate life, what we know for a fact is that they get less feedback
00:28:00.500 --> 00:28:24.079 Gena Cox: than other people. They get less feedback partially because of this social distance between them and those people who could give them the feedback. And I'll quickly tell you the story. About the time I was giving a talk, and a wonderful man came up to me afterwards. He was a young man, a young leader, and he came up to me afterwards a white male, and he said, You know I have this black woman on my team, and I don't know how to lead her, and I said, Tell me more.
00:28:24.080 --> 00:28:38.590 Gena Cox: and he explained that you know he there were some things he would like to see her do differently, but he was afraid to tell her those things. Well, why are you afraid to tell her? Well, I'm afraid of how she's going to react. If I tell her these things that she doesn't necessarily want to hear or might not want to hear. I said, Well.
00:28:38.590 --> 00:29:02.250 Gena Cox: what do you do with the other people on your team when you have the same issue. Oh, I tell them! And I said, Well, here's the thing. How you manage a black woman is how you manage a white man, a purple person like everybody needs the best leadership from you, which is to say, right now you're short changing her because she doesn't know what she's doing well, nor does she know that she's about to fall off the edge of a cliff.
00:29:02.290 --> 00:29:19.159 Gena Cox: How could she ever excel so that issue of This the way that I think about respect bring creates an opportunity to kind of bridge the gap to get to the key outcome that really matters, which is, help me do better help me do my best.
00:29:19.700 --> 00:29:21.690 Mira Brancu: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
00:29:21.940 --> 00:29:33.789 Mira Brancu: So we're reaching another ad break. And we just got done talking through. What does inclusion really look like from the perspective of respect.
00:29:34.120 --> 00:29:58.799 Mira Brancu: At the individual level with each individual person. The next thing, when we come back from the ad break, I'd really love to go to the next challenge that you had started off with, which is the chief diversity officers. Where are we going with this? What what to do do we do something different? Why, why have we missed the mark? Would love to sort of explore that with you when we come back? You're listening to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mary
00:29:58.800 --> 00:30:04.560 Mira Brancu: Bronco and our guest today, Dr. Gina Cox, author of leading Inclusion, and we'll be right back in just a moment.
00:32:05.110 --> 00:32:11.769 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Bronku and our guest today, Dr. Gina Cox, author of leading Inclusion
00:32:12.120 --> 00:32:21.909 Mira Brancu: alright. So where we left off. Personally, I would probably want to deep dive for the rest of the call just on this. But
00:32:22.506 --> 00:32:25.970 Mira Brancu: I'll just put it out there that if you want to learn more
00:32:26.530 --> 00:32:27.590 Mira Brancu: about
00:32:27.790 --> 00:32:28.890 Mira Brancu: simply
00:32:29.070 --> 00:32:45.540 Mira Brancu: how to, as a leader, demonstrate to someone that you're seeing them, you're hearing them, and you're valuing them reach out to Gina. Okay? Because it sounds easy. But I've seen so many leaders miss the mark
00:32:45.750 --> 00:32:46.750 Mira Brancu: that
00:32:47.190 --> 00:32:50.889 Mira Brancu: it is a hard skill. It is an important skill
00:32:50.970 --> 00:33:00.800 Mira Brancu: reached out to Gina. I'm just saying that. Okay, let's move on to the next topic. Okay? So the the other thing that I wanted to to follow up on is we've talked about the chief diversity officer
00:33:00.820 --> 00:33:01.590 Mira Brancu: and
00:33:02.920 --> 00:33:04.739 Mira Brancu: We've now seen backlash
00:33:05.750 --> 00:33:30.160 Mira Brancu: with the chief diversity officer positions where I've seen like layoffs that are sort of removing that position or budget challenges that are sort of like. Let's just remove that and it's very frustrating to see. But perhaps there's new ways, and you know perhaps there's still other ways to do this. So I'm really curious to hear
00:33:30.170 --> 00:33:36.250 Mira Brancu: from you. How, what are, how, what are you interpreting about this? And where do you think we can go from here?
00:33:37.384 --> 00:33:46.461 Gena Cox: well, the 1st thing I would say will say, won't sound very optimistic. But then the second thing i'll say, will, sound very optimistic.
00:33:46.860 --> 00:33:47.950 Gena Cox: So
00:33:48.510 --> 00:34:14.239 Gena Cox: when I hear these conversations about backlash, I have to be very cautious, because, as I said before, in the big scheme of things, even if you just count from 1,966 till now. This pattern of you know, 3 steps forward, 2 steps back, 3 steps forward, 2 steps back is not unusual. That is what always happens, and we happen, unfortunately, though, to be in an era where in this case the 3 steps forward
00:34:14.239 --> 00:34:43.889 Gena Cox: has been met with a very, very dramatic push back, more dramatic than I have personally of experienced in my 25 plus year career, and more dramatic than I think. We have seen at any other point absent, you know, literally, you know, before the 19 sixties, when we you know some of these opportunities did not exist at all. In other words, the progress that was made from 1966. It appears as if there are some forces that are determined to sort of push that all backwards.
00:34:44.260 --> 00:35:01.370 Gena Cox: And so Dee and I has become the boogeyman for that. It's a it's a way that people use the language to say, this has something to do with reverse discrimination, although the words reverse discrimination are not used like they used to be used in the 19 nineties.
00:35:01.430 --> 00:35:10.679 Gena Cox: So all of that is very real. And what is very alarming to me is that a lot of this effort is being funded by billionaires.
00:35:10.690 --> 00:35:30.593 Gena Cox: very prominent billionaires. Which is why I say that a person like myself doing my work in my little corner of the of my in my house in my, in my small clientele, and so on, and trying to have people think differently. I don't spend any energy fighting against that backlash. I cannot win that I don't think anybody can.
00:35:30.920 --> 00:35:50.659 Gena Cox: So I do think this is where the optimism comes in. We've got to figure out. How do we keep moving forward in spite of whatever is going on in the forces that we cannot control. And I think that that means is that this kind of work is going to evolve. Now, some of the some of the evolution is evolution. I have longed for.
00:35:50.660 --> 00:36:14.110 Gena Cox: For example, when I talk about how you can't just hire De and I leaders put them in a box over to the side and think that that's solving any problems that can't ha! That's gonna not happen anymore. Because well, 1st of all, there won't be as many of those positions. There won't be as much support. But I think it's become more evident that one way that this work could survive is if it were integrated into all the other strategic
00:36:14.110 --> 00:36:36.409 Gena Cox: priorities that we have. This is 1 1 part of everything that we do, and we factor it in. And we ask our leaders and everybody in the organization to behave in a way that is consistent with whatever values we create for the organization that support a healthy culture, an inclusive culture. So again, it has to start from the top.
00:36:36.490 --> 00:36:38.330 Gena Cox: That is to say, then, that
00:36:38.900 --> 00:36:48.850 Gena Cox: there would be people doing some of these things that have to do with culture, things that have to do with leadership, things that have to do with employee experience, and how they relate to inclusion
00:36:49.080 --> 00:37:06.539 Gena Cox: in a distributed fashion, not just residing within one role or one function within an Hr. Department that that has a questionable power in the 1st place, power and authority. So I think there's that I think another way that these things will change is that
00:37:06.550 --> 00:37:30.439 Gena Cox: oh, I didn't mention this other barrier when we talked at the beginning, only because I didn't want to make a list that was longer than 3. But one of the other big mistakes that I saw happening was the proliferation of employee resource groups. There's nothing wrong with employee resource groups at all. But there's something wrong when those groups were created as the strategy like.
00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:37.530 Gena Cox: oh, we'll create this group. People will do whatever they need to do in those groups. We don't need to know what it is. Problem, solve everybody's happy.
00:37:37.530 --> 00:38:01.389 Gena Cox: So those kinds of things ergs are going to evolve dramatically because what started to happen as a result of their mismanagement from the top, I think, is that there started to be this fighting between within the ergs and then fighting between people in ergs and people outside of ergs. Well, how come? I don't have an erg, or how come they get resources to focus on this thing? Nobody's giving me resource like
00:38:01.390 --> 00:38:10.109 Gena Cox: that is not that's not sustainable, right? So ergs will evolve to do what one of my clients does so very well, which is.
00:38:10.150 --> 00:38:35.079 Gena Cox: use the ergs and define the membership, however, but make it making it open to every anyone who's interested. But these groups are going to become sort of the channels for growing in the members of the group to become the most effective members of the organization that they could be so developing their interpersonal skills, their leadership skills, their communication skills and so on. I have a client that does this so very
00:38:35.230 --> 00:38:46.770 Gena Cox: well. I mean, they just say, workforce development is a priority. And this is how we, one of the ways we get it done is within these ergs. But it's not based primarily on identity.
00:38:47.710 --> 00:39:10.239 Gena Cox: and then I think the 3rd thing that will certainly change well, that I hope will change is that Dei has been a segregated profession, segregated by race and segregated by identity. When I I'd like to see more white males very specifically saying white males, there's not, an I'm not, you know. It's not an accident.
00:39:10.240 --> 00:39:34.479 Gena Cox: But until anybody thinks that he or she can have a positive make a positive difference, and have a viable career in work that supports inclusion. Inclusion is always going to be a dead end opportunity? Right? So I think that's something that would have to. It's a it's a i don't think that can change overnight, but I think it's something that would have to change in order for this work to really have the impact
00:39:34.530 --> 00:39:37.849 Gena Cox: that all of us who care about it desire.
00:39:38.100 --> 00:39:44.299 Mira Brancu: Hmm, yeah. The the thing that I'm I'm pulling out of that in addition, is
00:39:44.430 --> 00:39:52.519 Mira Brancu: right now. It seems like the backlash. Partly is people feeling quote, unquote, excluded, or left out.
00:39:52.520 --> 00:39:53.010 Gena Cox: Yes.
00:39:53.010 --> 00:39:56.431 Mira Brancu: Of each of these groups and that
00:39:57.030 --> 00:39:59.869 Mira Brancu: you know the the support
00:40:00.406 --> 00:40:05.400 Mira Brancu: is relegated to a specific function and focused on a specific identity
00:40:05.510 --> 00:40:06.235 Mira Brancu: and
00:40:07.190 --> 00:40:19.570 Mira Brancu: for those of you who are not familiar. Erg's employee resource groups. It's focused usually on some kind of identity, like focused on a women's group, or black leaders group, or something like that.
00:40:20.070 --> 00:40:31.470 Mira Brancu: And what I'm hearing from you, which I also am pulling out some hope from this. So I appreciate your validation plus reassurance around. This is what could be next.
00:40:31.870 --> 00:40:44.760 Mira Brancu: The next iteration is just recognizing. If one group suffers, we all suffer. And if we if one group and we are like all groups, succeed
00:40:44.770 --> 00:40:51.940 Mira Brancu: that that is of benefit to all right, like, if we could pull out the very best, if we could develop the very best out of all of our employees.
00:40:52.080 --> 00:40:54.660 Mira Brancu: Then everyone wins.
00:40:54.660 --> 00:40:55.540 Gena Cox: It's just.
00:40:55.540 --> 00:41:08.820 Mira Brancu: Trying to sort of extract ourselves out of the Us. Versus them. Othering of people scarcity mindset. Kind of stuff, too. I I'm making. I'm pulling some some things you haven't mentioned, but this is kind of where my head is going with it.
00:41:08.820 --> 00:41:12.790 Gena Cox: Yeah. And I think you're absolutely right. And I and I will tell you one thing, though.
00:41:13.191 --> 00:41:35.389 Gena Cox: And that is that the outcome for all of this is really going to be determined. Part of this whole idea of the you know the Us. Versus them, or people feeling excluded, part of that is legitimate and real like it's it's almost an automatic human reaction, right? So that part seems very normal. But what some people have done is sort of gin that up
00:41:35.390 --> 00:42:00.389 Gena Cox: to the point where it's become a a point of, you know, sort of a point of contention. Because, in fact, we could assault. We could address this problem, address the problem with some people, feel excluded without at the same time fighting against those who we've been trying to help. The 2 things are not mutually exclusive, but that is how the equation has been set up, currently. And I. And so I say that because I'm not. I don't want to be naive as I. As I talk on this conversation.
00:42:00.390 --> 00:42:21.350 Gena Cox: I think there's some very powerful financial interests and people with power who really would prefer that we just have a fight about this as opposed to find a solution. And so those of us who have good intentions just have to keep focusing on the on the good stuff and and pretend like we don't know although that stuff is very real.
00:42:22.410 --> 00:42:23.870 Mira Brancu: Yeah, I
00:42:25.960 --> 00:42:27.510 Mira Brancu: I wonder
00:42:28.680 --> 00:42:30.200 Mira Brancu: if we
00:42:30.660 --> 00:42:39.160 Mira Brancu: just ignore those very large power in powerful influences, the billionaires who?
00:42:39.340 --> 00:42:44.390 Mira Brancu: Not all billionaires? Okay. But the billionaires who are focusing on
00:42:45.130 --> 00:42:49.379 Mira Brancu: trying to keep the status quo in a certain way.
00:42:50.098 --> 00:42:52.729 Mira Brancu: If we sort of focus away from that.
00:42:54.620 --> 00:42:59.129 Mira Brancu: do we have the power to do that? Maybe this is the question. In my mind.
00:42:59.130 --> 00:42:59.779 Gena Cox: Do we.
00:42:59.780 --> 00:43:02.319 Mira Brancu: Have the power to do that. What? What's your thought on that.
00:43:02.320 --> 00:43:27.659 Gena Cox: Yeah. And I think that's the question that I ask myself every day. Because and I have to answer, Yes, because if I answer anything other than yes, I would just stay in bed with the covers over my head, and not do anything for another day. I mean, there was a period of time, you know. I live in the State of Florida, and this conversation comes so much, and there was a period of time where I was like somebody said to me, Well, can you sell your book in Florida like, can you talk about inclusion in Florida?
00:43:28.320 --> 00:43:37.900 Gena Cox: And it truly felt like a very sort of personal thing I had to get past that I had to realize I had to not let. I had to force myself to say.
00:43:37.930 --> 00:43:46.159 Gena Cox: I I will do the one thing I can do. I will do that, and then I'll do it the second time. I'll do it the 3rd time, and I had to keep telling myself that I would imagine.
00:43:46.330 --> 00:44:10.150 Gena Cox: And I'm not the spokesperson for these people. But De and I, leaders across this country are probably there, there, some proportion of them are thinking. I just have to get out of this altogether because I gotta go. I gotta take care of my kids, my family, and I can't be living wondering every day if I'm gonna have a job tomorrow. So I am. I am. I have. I am the optimistic, idealistic one who says that we can.
00:44:10.150 --> 00:44:27.520 Gena Cox: And we have to be clever and think about new ways and make the adjustments, some of which we've talked about. We can't just keep pretending like it's not there. But and when I say ignore, I don't mean pretend like it's not there. We have to be smart about. Well, what are alternative things that we can do? Actions we can take.
00:44:28.140 --> 00:44:56.249 Mira Brancu: Absolutely what is in our sphere of influence. We talked about this on a on a previous episode. You can get really burnt out, thinking of all of the things that you can't do. But there are plenty of things we could do in our own sphere of influence. And let me tell you, Gina did just fine with her book. It's award winning, she it's she succeeded on that front, even with those fears, right? Because she knew what was in her fear of influence as well. So
00:44:56.750 --> 00:45:02.330 Mira Brancu: we're reaching an ad break. We'll be right back in just a moment with our guest, Dr. Gina Cox.
00:47:05.710 --> 00:47:11.520 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Brancu and our guest today, Dr. Gina Cox.
00:47:11.890 --> 00:47:18.204 Mira Brancu: So, Gina, we we went through sort of like exploring the
00:47:18.990 --> 00:47:21.709 Mira Brancu: focus on inclusion and
00:47:22.540 --> 00:47:39.359 Mira Brancu: seeing the whole person through the respect lens we thought through like, where are we going with everything. If the Chief diversity officer position is too much for just one or small group of people, and not resource well enough.
00:47:39.490 --> 00:47:40.255 Mira Brancu: And
00:47:41.410 --> 00:47:46.219 Mira Brancu: you in your book. You talk about this sort of like
00:47:46.660 --> 00:47:58.919 Mira Brancu: biggest level of organizational impact, which is kind of like making inclusion scalable. What does that mean? And what would that look like? And have you seen it? I would love an example if you've seen it.
00:47:59.500 --> 00:48:07.583 Gena Cox: Yeah, I mean. Well, you know, I wrote, the title of my book is leading inclusion tribe. Change. Your employees can see and feel.
00:48:07.990 --> 00:48:28.720 Gena Cox: and it. And throughout the book, what I'm I'm trying to say is that none of this is possible if it isn't led from the top of an organization. So even when I talk, think about scalability, I'm not thinking about something abstract I'm thinking about into, I'm thinking about individual members of executive teams, individual members of boards of directors who number one
00:48:28.720 --> 00:48:45.769 Gena Cox: believe that this work is necessary. They could believe it's necessary. I I think it's a leadership in obligation, and that's pure, that's sufficient. But they might think it's a financial necessity. Given the fact that they might be trying to, you know, make money in marketplaces that are diverse.
00:48:46.280 --> 00:49:11.249 Gena Cox: and need to really understand as much as they can about a more diverse market, and therefore a more diverse workforce. They might be thinking about this from the perspective of of innovation. They might be thinking about this from the perspective of patient experience, like my clients in the healthcare industry and also nurse registered nurse retention. I mean, there could be a variety of problems that an organization might challenges and
00:49:11.250 --> 00:49:16.699 Gena Cox: organization might be wanting to solve, where inclusion is just the ticket.
00:49:16.700 --> 00:49:19.519 Gena Cox: except that we don't always talk about
00:49:19.670 --> 00:49:38.920 Gena Cox: about it in that way, you know, when sometimes clients call me up and they say, we want work. We want to do some work with our executive team to really start thinking about our or let's call it our diversity, equity, and inclusion strategy, or it might even say, belonging alphabet soup. So so they'll say that to me that's usually how it comes up right
00:49:39.360 --> 00:50:04.130 Gena Cox: and what they don't know, I say, of course, and we have our pre work, and we plan the whole thing out. And then, on the day when we do the when we get together. What they don't. What they think is gonna happen is they think I'm gonna come out. And they think I'm gonna talk about anti racism. And they think I'm gonna talk about implicit bias training. And they think I'm gonna say all. And and some of those things will come up in the conversation. But what I actually am focusing and starting the conversation with is talking about.
00:50:04.470 --> 00:50:12.996 Gena Cox: What is it that you want to accomplish as a business? Tell me what your financial strategic goals are for this? What is your vision for this business? What is it you want to accomplish?
00:50:13.240 --> 00:50:38.210 Gena Cox: Because this whole idea of scalability hinges upon the notion that leaders begin to incorporate the conversation about inclusion in the conversation, about their business priorities. It's part and parcel of all of it, you know, when I think about effective organizations and effective leadership. And I say, you know, when I say, well, what if? Let's say we had a a circle, a pie, that in into which we want to put the elements that are necessary for
00:50:38.210 --> 00:50:42.989 Gena Cox: operational success in a business. And I asked leaders, what are some of the things that go into it.
00:50:43.320 --> 00:51:08.000 Gena Cox: They'll always talk about finance and marketing and sales and product development and customer service. Always there's it's that's those are. That's the, you know, essential. They'll talk about those things. And if this were a ring, you know, and they put them like wedges of them into this into this circle. They'll be very happy with that. And then somewhere along the line, they would talk about humans somewhere along the line. It wouldn't be in the top 3, often right or top 4 even.
00:51:08.270 --> 00:51:34.410 Gena Cox: And so then I say, well, okay, we still got the circle. Where would you put the humans in that then. And they recognize you can't wedge the humans into any part of that ring. You have to now, either put them in the core. Well, you could put them, or you might think of them as a surrounding. But I say, what about if you think about them as being as the core of the of the donut right? The donut hole is filled with humans. The humans are necessary to do all this stuff. And oh, by the way.
00:51:34.410 --> 00:51:45.120 Gena Cox: what do those humans look like? And then what do you need? And what are the characteristics and skills? And so on. And then how do they need to work together and the conversation eventually. And then we start to talk about well, what
00:51:45.120 --> 00:52:03.960 Gena Cox: what do you have to do from the top of this organization in terms of establishing the the values that you are going to operate under that can deliver this future that you just said you wanted, and magically, the words, respect and inclusion will come out of their mouths without my prompting them to do that right?
00:52:04.250 --> 00:52:05.250 Gena Cox: So when I
00:52:05.710 --> 00:52:25.850 Gena Cox: thank you, yeah, when I think about scalability. I don't think of it in terms of programs or initiatives at all. I mean Dei programs and Dei initiatives. I think of it in terms of getting leaders to focus on what matters most. And then recognizing how they use humans of all types, you know, to accomplish it. And and that's that's it.
00:52:26.460 --> 00:52:32.050 Mira Brancu: That is just it. It's brilliant and it it sounds
00:52:32.250 --> 00:52:38.540 Mira Brancu: so obvious. And yet it doesn't come to the forefront until you do activity like that.
00:52:38.540 --> 00:52:40.002 Gena Cox: Yes, you know
00:52:40.490 --> 00:52:49.539 Mira Brancu: And and it's practically the the definition of organizational development is there's people driving all of the things that you want to accomplish.
00:52:49.540 --> 00:52:50.789 Gena Cox: Yes, and how.
00:52:50.790 --> 00:52:53.979 Mira Brancu: You get those people to work at their very best top of their level.
00:52:54.160 --> 00:53:16.710 Gena Cox: Absolutely. And I will tell you there is one organization. There are 2 organizations, actually, 2 global organizations with which I've had the pleasure to work over the years. One of those organizations was run at the time by a gentleman who was a Sikh, and I might be mispronouncing that I'm never. Some people say Sikh and some people say Sikh, but SIKH. And because of his
00:53:16.710 --> 00:53:41.140 Gena Cox: personal values he established corporate values. It was the Ex company way that were focused and centered on the human experience, on respect. And these basic fundamental ways of interacting. That was his strategic commitment obligation, definition to this company. This is how we're gonna get. We're gonna build the billions that we want to get
00:53:41.140 --> 00:53:51.410 Gena Cox: and guess what they did it, and that those values still still exist, and the other company I mentioned similar thing. So some people understand this idea for whatever reason.
00:53:51.410 --> 00:54:16.340 Gena Cox: But some people undervalue this idea, or don't think about it at all. And when I am invited by people to talk to startup companies that are early in their growth cycle, I get very nervous because large companies. It is a bit easier in some way to think about these things, cause they have more degrees of freedom. But in younger organizations where the damage can be done
00:54:16.340 --> 00:54:22.490 Gena Cox: by just one person's interaction with one other person. I think it tends to get undervalued.
00:54:23.140 --> 00:54:24.726 Mira Brancu: Yeah, absolutely.
00:54:26.040 --> 00:54:28.899 Mira Brancu: this is probably generating a lot
00:54:29.000 --> 00:54:36.679 Mira Brancu: of interest, and probably more questions. And so I am curious
00:54:36.700 --> 00:54:43.220 Mira Brancu: where I'm going to pull it up. On my screen as well. But where can people find out more about you?
00:54:43.400 --> 00:55:10.120 Gena Cox: Yeah, definitely, you can go to my website. It's Gina cox.com go to my link, go to find me on Linkedin. I love talking to people on Linkedin. And if you're interested in some additional resources that you can just grab, you can go to Gina cox.com slash inclusion, resources, inclusion, resources. And you can do get some downloads from there. This is a this is more, though, than just an initiative.
00:55:11.062 --> 00:55:36.399 Gena Cox: You know, when I think about this work, it's more than just thinking about de and I initiatives. I consider this to be a a way to be an ethos. It's a point of view. It's a way. You see the world. It's a mind set shift so I call it. You know, the respect ethos. When I think about this, because I'm really thinking that we, if we operate in a certain way as we run our businesses.
00:55:36.400 --> 00:55:47.279 Gena Cox: and as we interact with each other in the corporate in our communities. Maybe I'm being, you know, one of those people with a roll of colored glasses. But I actually think this is how we get to this
00:55:47.480 --> 00:55:54.549 Gena Cox: needed connection that the Surgeon General warns. You know that we we absolutely need for survival.
00:55:54.960 --> 00:56:17.370 Mira Brancu: I agree, and who cares if it's rose colored glasses? It's exactly what we need. So, audience, what did you take away? That's what I took away. What did you take away from today? And more importantly, what is one small change you can implement this week, based on what you learned from Gina. Share it with us on Linkedin. We both live there, and so we would cheer you on if you share it with us right there
00:56:17.370 --> 00:56:25.110 Mira Brancu: and talk. Radio. Nyc is also on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter twitch all over the place as well as coming out
00:56:25.110 --> 00:56:47.260 Mira Brancu: from the live show into podcasts on apple spotify and Amazon Podcasts. Please help us increase our visibility, reach and impact by leaving a review and definitely share this episode around. When you hear it, the stuff we talk about on this show is part of our research based strategic leadership, pathway, roadmap that we also teach in our telescope Leadership Academy and that fuel program I mentioned earlier on.
00:56:47.310 --> 00:57:00.289 Mira Brancu: You can find all of that@gotowerscope.com, and definitely be sure to look up leading inclusion by Dr. Gina Cox as well as check her out@ginacox.com.
00:57:00.460 --> 00:57:12.900 Mira Brancu: Thank you. Talk radio. Nyc for hosting. I'm Dr. Mirabranku, your host of the Hard skills show and thank you for joining us today. Gina, have a great rest of your day. Everybody, wherever you're tuning in from bye. Everyone.
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